Proposal to "lock" POIs location.
Robert4444-ING
Posts: 830 ✭✭✭✭
As we all know, moving POIs is a plague. I propose that "locking" be introduced in the game mechanics. If a given number of people indicate that the location is correct, then the portal cannot be moved using the app. I invite you to join the discussion.
Post edited by Basslord808-ING on
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I agree and I'm both hands on board for something like this! When portals are moved from the real life location only to appear as pokestops in Pokemon GO it destroys the in-game experience (at least for Ingress)! Sometimes, the portal is moved so far, thar I can't even scan a portal because when I'm at the real life location, I'm not in range to scan it! That's frustrating and destroys the game!
But I wonder how it could be achieved? Because, if you make it dependant on the players, there'll always be a place for faul play (like it is now with wayfarer). Even if we introduce an "in game" question "is this PIO in the correct location" players might settle what they want on a forum (like they do now) and most of the players can vote "yes it is" even if it's not...
Maybe deviding the database and making a separate for each game is a good thing to do?
Or... Giving some players, that are known and respected in the comunity, the power to move and lock portals? For example, players from both factions, that are L16 (or recursed) can be chosen in each cell (they can be even "trust voted" in some way) and they could gain "a big power, with big responsibility" to do so!
And even NIA could have a database of those players and have a list of POIs moved by them, and if the players are happy with what the "chosen player" has done - his "trust meter" goes higher... If there are many complaints (with evidence!) that he makes faoul play - the power is taken from him!
If a "chosen player" gains much respect, he can even add descriptions or change portal names without the Wyfarer program, as this is also a topic...
Those players could be "Rangers" in some way - keeping the portal network as close to the real world as possible. It would be usefull, as you want to introduce the scanned 3D portals in the game. If the location is incorrect, there's no point.
I'm also open to discussion. We can find the best solution together! :)
Regards!
eMGieBe
I disagree. This feature exists to exactly correct the location of the POI if it have been moved. And, after the player demand the "edit", it will be voted by the wayfarer before any chance is accepted.
Strongly disagree. You could just misplace Portals and then ask other players of your fraction in ING or in general other players in PGO to gain an advantage. However, Id love to get trusted players who can edit POIs without any voting. In my city, that takes over three years so not a very nice time xD.
@FurtadoV-PGO the feature gets constantly and consistently abused to ensure "correct" location for purpose of gym creation. If the portal/gym is in correct place then it should get locked to prevent abuse, but the correct place being where it's in real life and not where it's in correct cell.
Another idea worth considering is to introduce a live event when it's possible for several players to agree on location while they are at the location.
So the "community of blinds" decided to move 3 POIs in Gdańsk from their correct locations quite randomly to free S2. Pathetic...
A new message on this issue is pending approval in "Location Edits".
Lets go back to the beginning:
- should the POI be exactly (or as close as possible) where it is in real life? (I think YES)
- if a POI has been in the right location and moved so just it can become a poke stop, should it be moved back to where the real life location is? (I think YES)
And about abuses of the "Rangers"... It could be a cross-faction job. For example, the chosen players can have a special layer or a button in the scanner. When one of the Rangers sugests the location should be moved, it doesn't happen, but the portal is "Flagged" (or "ornamented") and then, it has to be "aproved" by 3 or 5 Agents, at least 1 from each faction. Then, the voted portal is moved where it belongs and can't be moved through wayfarer just to create pokestops.
I think we don't even need to choose those players - we can give that power to Recursed players, so those who went through that get a benefit - something extra. So only Recursed players can suggest a "move and lock" and other Recursed players can vote if the proposed change is valid.
I think the whole problem is because those two games, that have a diffrent gameplay share the same database... When one game is affecting the other, the players in the game get upset. I can understand, that Pokemon players want more stops/gyms, but that destroys the portal network in Ingress...
There seems to be an underlying huge assumption that the community - I presume across ingress and Pokémon go - is any better at selecting “trusted players” than selecting the correct point when presented with an edit. i don’t think so.
It is too open to self righteous cabals across the current and future games, making changes. Some I have seen are nitpicking over a very small distance so that you can hardly see the difference. Very similar to those arguing over a comma or dash in the title, or whether it can start with “The” 🙄
The current process can be very slow, but I view that as much better, sheer length of time would put off random changes, and be decided by the same range of people. Sometimes things do change that involve relatively short distances - new tennis courts built and old ones taken up, a sculpture or monument moved as part of a redesign, the entrance completely changed - nothing to be suspicious of, a locked position would be a hinderance.
Having a system of referral to Niantic staff for those proving difficult to resolve or too far apart seems a sensible backstop.
Please stop writing useless insults in this forum and stay on the topic of the discussion.
Ingress vanguards can already do this. We've had to get a portal locked because of malicious moves to drop links.
I think a six-month (or a year) location lock makes a lot of sense.
When a waypoint is created, the nominator and the community give input on its placement. Fine. It can't be moved for six months. (Maybe allow only the nominator to suggest a location edit in those first 6 months.)
If it's in the wrong place, then in six (or more) months, someone can suggest an edit. The community again decides, and the location is locked again for another six months.
If the community made the wrong decision, anyone can appeal to Niantic, with proof, same as now.
If the physical waypoint has moved, well, it's probably been six months since its last action anyway.
It's frustrating to reviewers, to see the same location move over and over. Currently they can just keep trying 100 times.
No matter what solution is used, there will still be abuses and quarrels between the communities of both games. The best solution is to stop using the S2 cell system and make every POI that is in Ingress also appear in Pokemon GO.
All you have to do to evaluate your suggestion is to ask, "How could this be abused?" In this case, the answer is that a cabal of abusers could use this feature to lock a wayspot at an invalid location. To me that seems like a worse situation than what we have now.
Perhaps there should be a higher level of scrutiny for moves that cross pogo cell boundaries? I too am tired of abusive moves to put things in different cells.
Absolutely NO. Either players from both games are already abusing things.
Even if Niantic would agree, Niantic themshelves must confirm if the Wayspots are correctly placed before "locking" them for location edits. Just forget the idea if you guys want to lock misplaced Wayspots, or even fakes.
@NianticGiffard @NianticVK @NianticAtlas by the way some users here have derailed this thread so, your actions please.
Just to add another note that, not every Wayspots are on permanent locations. Moveable objects like statues sometimes might got relocated, while businesses might move into a new address.
When it first goes into the database is the worst time to lock it, IMHO. That's the first chance submitters have to see where it ended-up and if it came to the correct location.
For example, I submitted a location on a hill and it came out in the wrong place because the satellite photos were slightly stretched. I didn't realize this until it came in the game and I could physically go stand on the POI in game and see how far it was away from the actual location of the object (while looking to be correct in the satellite photos).
Anyway, I assumed this post was originally about Niantic being able to internally lock waypoints that people fight over after Niantic makes a ruling on which location is correct. I would definitely agree with that. I agree with @Hosette-ING and others that players would collude and abuse the feature as proposed by OP.
This assumed that the point of interest is established to be in the right spot to begin with. And that's certainly not always the case. So not keen in locking something in place when it can be wrong.
I'd love something like this for waypoints that are subject to numerous hostile edits. There's a schism in one of our local game teams where two different groups on the same team tend to target each others' home waypoints for various edits and photo wars. I've seen dozens, maybe hundreds, of location edits submitted for one player's home portal, as well as description/title edits and photo uploads. I'd love it if, when a certain threshold of denied edits is reached, location edits could be disabled for a set time span.
Thanks for the lively discussion on this thread. Based on the content of the discussion, I will be closing it for future comments. I appreciate your understanding.