Temporary Cherries

X0bai-PGOX0bai-PGO Posts: 1,211 ✭✭✭✭✭

From Sturgeon Bay Wisconsin lately has come a large number of submissions of painted cherries (because Door County has a lot of cherry orchards). I certainly agree that these are all unique, interesting, and worth exploring:

Problem being they are all temporary, as evidenced by the signage that accompanies them:

They are on display for auction until September 17, at which point they will be purchased and relocated. In some of the images you can see the base, which is not bolted down or secured in any way. Here’s a summary of the program, reiterating the September 17 date:

I have been rejecting these as temporary, since they very clearly are. But it seems not everyone has examined the signs (which, to be fair, are not present in all the images):


What can be done about this? The area also has a large number of decorated metal fish POIs, which I suspect were part of a prior year’s summer art display and are likely no longer present in the mapped pin locations.

Comments

  • 29andCounting-PGO29andCounting-PGO Posts: 235 ✭✭✭

    The bidding ends in September but will they be relocated right away?

  • X0bai-PGOX0bai-PGO Posts: 1,211 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Does it matter if they’re relocated on the 17th or the 18th or the 25th or on Veteran’s Day or the New Year? They’re intended to move.

  • djshari-INGdjshari-ING Posts: 50 ✭✭✭

    Why worry about this now? A city near me had something similar and many of the businesses that displayed/sponsored them purchased them and they stayed put - this was two years ago and they are still there.

  • X0bai-PGOX0bai-PGO Posts: 1,211 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited August 4

    Because I’m getting disagreements in my Wayfarer rating by voting correctly.

  • 29andCounting-PGO29andCounting-PGO Posts: 235 ✭✭✭

    Niantic has stated that permanent in their eyes is something that could reasonably be expected to last 6 months or more. Which is why I was asking.

  • X0bai-PGOX0bai-PGO Posts: 1,211 ✭✭✭✭✭
  • 29andCounting-PGO29andCounting-PGO Posts: 235 ✭✭✭

    If you want agreements, accept them. If you’re worried that they will one day be gone, you’ll have to report them for removal when the time comes.

  • X0bai-PGOX0bai-PGO Posts: 1,211 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited August 4

    ‘Do what you know is wrong, on purpose’ is always a terrible answer. Like, shamefully awful.

    I’m not hard up for agreements. I don’t want disagreements, for myself or anybody else who is voting correctly. And the removal process is tedious enough without having to go to 25 different locations to remove overtly temporary installments that never should have been approved in the first place.

  • 29andCounting-PGO29andCounting-PGO Posts: 235 ✭✭✭

    I’m sorryI don’t know what kind of answer you’re looking for. You say “what can I do about this situation?” The answer is, there’s nothing you can do about this situation. Then someone asked a clarifying question about why it was important and you said it was because of agreements. There’s no good answer to your question.

  • X0bai-PGOX0bai-PGO Posts: 1,211 ✭✭✭✭✭

    No, I responded to a question worrying about it now because of disagreements.

    Follow-up question: is there a more concise definition of Wayfarer abuse than “doing what you know is wrong, on purpose”?

    I certainly didn’t start a thread about incorrectly accepted POI expecting to be told to stop acting with integrity.

  • Elijustrying-INGElijustrying-ING Posts: 1,258 ✭✭✭✭✭

    This sort of thing has become very popular over the summer period as it gives people something to do for free.

    where I live after the auction they move to permanent locations- I don’t think locally one has stayed where it was? Some have moved quite a few miles and will make great wayspots in their permanent home - this is easily backed up by websites.

    I vote on them as temporary and reject. You are more likely to easily spot this if local. A friend told how he had submitted one and would upgrade to avoid locals. I was not best pleased as it was only feet away from bar/ live music venue which would the never appear long after the art work had gone.

    To clean up afterwards is a huge ask of wayfarers.

    Personally I would have thought it possible to issue reminders of key criteria at different times of year - like a newsletter in June that temporary art trails are not acceptable. Perhaps a winter reminder that snow pictures are fine etc.

    At the moment all I can offer is my empathy @X0bai-PGO

  • Gendgi-PGOGendgi-PGO Posts: 2,874 Ambassador

    Not sure the best way to review them. There's several "art on the trails" programs in my area that place sculptures or other locally made art installations. They sometimes go down in the winter, they sometimes don't. They sometimes last a few months, some have lasted years.

    I had luck removing local ones and remote ones by providing a news link to Support that the art was temporary and had been removed. I'm not sure if they would be willing to take action before removal or even while they are still in voting.

  • 29andCounting-PGO29andCounting-PGO Posts: 235 ✭✭✭

    I was answering with “if/then” scenarios. IF you want agreements, THEN accept. IF they are moved THEN report then. I actually wasn’t encouraging either course of action. As for source, there’s pretty much no way I could find that answer again, so you may disregard.

  • SeVero2k-PGOSeVero2k-PGO Posts: 18 ✭✭

    I would 3- Star them, thats what Niantic says you should do if you are not sure.

    I care for my grade as well. I wouldn't want to trash it just because I know I'm correct...

  • Elijustrying-INGElijustrying-ING Posts: 1,258 ✭✭✭✭✭

    There are permanent art trails which are great but these are temporary. Personally I love them and they do get you exploring but they don’t last long.

    Here is a local example from a few years ago.

    One was bought at the end and is at a permanent home and is a great wayspot.

    I have seen all sorts of animals, bees, frogs, sheep, squirrels, cows to name a few.

    Submitters and reviewers need to be more on top of this.

  • djshari-INGdjshari-ING Posts: 50 ✭✭✭

    I do get them in my reviews, but never with the sign, I will reject them (at least for the next month).

  • Melurra-PGOMelurra-PGO Posts: 234 ✭✭✭✭

    I think this is more on the submitters than the reviewers, to be fair. They just see a new sculpture and think "sculpture = pokestop" and don't read the sign or choose selectively ignore the statement that it's a temporary exhibit. Even if the cherries don't move the day after the auction ends, they are intended to only temporarily be in that location. Sure, some businesses may buy the cherry outside their door and decide to leave it in place, but no one has any way of knowing that now. The reviewers might not reasonably come across the information that the cherries are just being displayed for a couple months for auctioning purposes, especially if the submitter is deliberately obscuring it. Some of the examples shown have what I presume to be the titles from the plaques, so I take it that the submitters read the plaques in some cases. But based on the large number of submissions I've seen in general for public art that say "artist unknown" because the submitter couldn't be bothered to spend 10 seconds reading a plaque or googling a signature, I'd say some don't read.

    We have pretty much an identical issue with the annual Chicago Sculpture Exhibition. They sculptures are displayed for a little while, no more than a year, and then they can be bought (also via auction, I believe). Some are then carted away to private buyers' residences. Others are moved to another non-PRP location. Some are purchased by the city/ward/neighborhood council and remain in that location indefinitely. But you can never know which it is when they are first installed. In Wayfarer terms, it's an endless cycle of accepted Wayspots and removal reports for most of them about 9 months later (or not, since "don't take away our stops!!")

  • MargariteDVille-INGMargariteDVille-ING Posts: 1,382 ✭✭✭✭✭

    For permanent art trails where the art is changed out periodically, I'd name them like "SculpTour Exhibit 1", then change out the picture as the art changes out.

  • Melurra-PGOMelurra-PGO Posts: 234 ✭✭✭✭

    Unfortunately the sculptures are not consistently placed year after year. For example, the northwest corner of "Main and Broadway" might host a sculpture one year but then not see a sculpture again for five years, or maybe there will be another one on Main and Broadway the year after, but on a different corner.

    Chicago is probably not the only place with this issue.

  • rufoushumming-PGOrufoushumming-PGO Posts: 117 ✭✭✭

    To your question what can be done about this. Keep reminding people what makes a good submission - remind reviewers what to look for. There are ways to do this. Niantic needs the will to do so

    But as big as Niantic is now. the ambiguity of Criteria. The communities that work together to ensure submissions pass. The use of reviewing to gain badges etc. And the fact we do this off our own back. That most people have little time so just process away. For some people it is a game to get everything nominated. It is a thankless task. Because so many people want so many different things. Sure not in the spirit of the game but with scale comes issues.

    And there is a point when people seek anything to nominate as ALL the most obvious things are nominated.

    This means Niantic needs to look at other ways to engage people. To get other types of badges. Offer basic training and make people do every 500 reviews. Don't give badges for revewing. don't give rewards for things that underpin the quality of POIs. Look at what drives quality and the principle of discovery, exercise and socialising. That requires good product management.

    What your point also raises is so many reviewers are tired. Why should they care when Niantic don't. When so much dross is getting through. Where they get abused for doing the right thing. I have seen responses where people say it is just easier to accept. That to me is a red flag that the process needs some TLC.

    What I like about the post is. It reminds me what to look for. What is important. How the criteria is good at guiding you

    I don't accept similar nominations. It is clear they are temporary and should be treated as such.

    Now if they are moved to a new home. bolted to the ground etc then yes I would accept.

    It is like the sculpture art walks. I have seen successful nominations for installations that only lasted 2 months. And I mean no replacement till the next sculpture art walk. I certainly nominate for removal.

    And regarding. Grade. Not sure what that is. Really I lose my grade if I reject things appropriately. Wow - I am totally set for a fall in Australia with my rejection of all the Survey Marks (mass produced generic 1 million of them).

    Thanks for sharing. Really does help me to be more focused

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