Public piano... "permanent" vs. "temporary"

What do you think about public piano?

A nice thing to explore or to share culture / music passion. Plus, it's usually a nice place to socialize.

I do understand that this is a large question. Some are placed outdoor in public parks and may be seasonal, but some others are placed inside public building hallway or in my case : inside an university.

I started studying there in 2016, and this piano was already there. Unfortunately, I did not found any online proof for this specific piano.

My point of view : it's not because a piano have wheels and "can" be moved that means it's necessarily temporary. Othwerise, any other submitted things can be removed...

The rejection criteria reads Location, place, or object is temporary, or highly unlikely to be permanent


What do you think?




Comments

  • X0bai-PGOX0bai-PGO Posts: 1,667 ✭✭✭✭✭

    So the question is about “temporary,” which I understand but think it only addresses part of the issue. It looks like a basic piano in a basic hallway to me, and I think the lack of historical information on the piano reinforces that. It’s certainly not a great place to socialize, that’s nonsense (nobody is asking their girlfriend out to the piano), and if I reviewed a nomination that suggested that a piano was a great place to socialize it would leave a very poor impression on me. Also, this is indoors and the location is probably very difficult to prove unless there’s a photosphere. So I think “temporary” is something of a fallback rejection for reviewers, because I think there are a lot of sources of dissatisfaction here.

    As for object permanence, it needs something to demonstrate that this piano was not wheeled into place ten minutes ago and wheeled away ten minutes later. It at least needs to look like it belongs there, and it doesn’t, particularly.

    So without an external source to show when - and maybe as important, why - the piano was placed there, overcoming “temporary” looks difficult to me; and without something to overtly meet the explore criteria - something that demonstrates that this is more than an unremarkable piano in an unremarkable hallway - I don’t see how it meets criteria to begin with.

  • Kroutpiick-PGOKroutpiick-PGO Posts: 370 ✭✭✭✭

    Thanks for your point of view! I asked the same question on a local community and you are the first reviewer that is able to fully and clearly explain why you would reject this as "temporary", and this is important for a constructive discussion!

    However, I disagree with you when you say that a public piano is not a great place to socialize. The criteria reads : "A favorite gathering place for friends or strangers alike, where you can share a drink or meal, be entertained, or watch public life happen."

    IMO, it's obvious that it's a nice place to socialize : listen to other locals playing piano, to sing a song, or to meet other persons that share the same music passion...

    (You would certainly not ask your gf out to a post office, or a transit station...)

    So I retain that the difficulty here is to proove that "this piano was not wheeled into place ten minutes ago and wheeled away ten minutes later". But it's still a piano, it's big and weight a lot... I'll keep looking for any online ref. about this piano so that I can provide a better support for the permanence.

  • tp235-INGtp235-ING Posts: 1,351 ✭✭✭✭✭

    360° photos, any website or news article announcing the installation.

    Then, when it is removed from its location, the same procedure is promptly followed to remove it.


    It would be good if you could prove those things.

  • Kroutpiick-PGOKroutpiick-PGO Posts: 370 ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 2023

    Finally found something, on the TikTok account of the university 😂😅

    https://www.tiktok.com/@usherbrooke/video/7140346020919020805

    At 0:22 to 0:24

  • Kroutpiick-PGOKroutpiick-PGO Posts: 370 ✭✭✭✭
    edited January 2023

    Looks like there is a URL encoding error. Replace "%40" by "@" : /@usherbrooke/

    https://www.tiktok.com/@usherbrooke/video/7140346020919020805

  • Janetx68-PGOJanetx68-PGO Posts: 82 ✭✭✭

    Pianos don't normally appear in the hallway of a university, so if you can can make a convincing case that it's a permanent feature, I would vote for it as worthy of exploration. Certainly a point of interest.

  • RandomExploit-INGRandomExploit-ING Posts: 941 ✭✭✭✭✭

    It is something that can be easily moved and often are moved, so reviewers are always going to vote it as temporary.

    Even if you could prove it has been there for 6 months, someone could easily move it in minutes tommorow.

    The chances it will stay in that hallway are slim...and the chances of you being able to prove otherwise is slimmer.

    Personally I would give up trying to get this one through ..

  • SeaprincessHNB-PGOSeaprincessHNB-PGO Posts: 1,523 Ambassador

    Well, I have started keeping a set of Bocce balls in my trunk to place on Bocce courts for photos so they don't look like generic strips of grass. I guess I have to get a truck so I can haul around a piano to wheel into place to take photos. Might have to paint it once a week so people don't realize it's the same piano. Carry around a few different items to place on top - a few different stools. Yeah, this plan is coming together nicely.

    /s

    NO ONE THINKS A PIANO IS TEMPORARY!!!!

  • Kroutpiick-PGOKroutpiick-PGO Posts: 370 ✭✭✭✭

    This made me laugh! Unfortunately, looks like some people didn't liked your sarcasm.

  • SeaprincessHNB-PGOSeaprincessHNB-PGO Posts: 1,523 Ambassador

    I have a very hard time imagining the lives these people live who are constantly either moving pianos around or watching others do so. I have only seen a piano be moved twice - once into the extra bedroom in our house and again a year later when we rented the room so it had to be moved out. Although watching Coyote and Roadrunner did teach me to beware of them falling out of the sky randomly.

  • X0bai-PGOX0bai-PGO Posts: 1,667 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 2023

    A church I used to attend had a piano similar to the one in the image - which is clearly on wheels - and it was moved all the time: on and off the stage area, into a storage closet, into the lobby, once even loaded into a truck and driven to a seniors home for a youth choir performance. So, yeah, this is quite portable, as pianos go. Two people could move it easily; one determined person could do so.

    It’s not like this is a baby grand which is going to take four people hours and hours of tipping this way and that and a rubber mallet to remove the legs and tilt it to this side to load it on the dolly… this one you can push. It’s not that hard, especially on the flat surface shown.

    In fact, I also remember a similar piano at my elementary school. It was moved between the music room and the auditorium for performances; the pianist, who was a diminutive man, would have just one student help him move it.

  • SeaprincessHNB-PGOSeaprincessHNB-PGO Posts: 1,523 Ambassador

    OK, but would you say that its primary location, while it was being used, was on the stage? I would have no problem approving the primary location for a moveable object, especially if the use of that object while it is in that spot meets one of the 3 main criteria. To me, this is not very different than nominating a mural inside a business that closes. You can't access the mural while the business is closed, just like you can't access the piano while it is in the closet. But when it is "open" in the primary spot, it is used for sing-a-longs or whatever.

    Your elementary school example is a moot point since we can't approve (non-outdoor basketball courts) at schools. But, let's change it to a college. In that case, I'd say the music room is the primary location so I would not be bothered in the slightest about approving the piano in the music room. In theory, the auditorium where the stage is located would already qualify as a POI on its own.

  • X0bai-PGOX0bai-PGO Posts: 1,667 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 2023

    So that’s a different argument from “nobody thinks a piano is temporary,” but I’m game.

    I disagree with the entirety of the argument and the thinking behind it, on the basis that a “primary” location is nowhere in criteria, and in fact the very nature of the claim concedes that the location is temporary. An object is ineligible if it is “highly unlikely to be permanent,” and there is no criteria concession for whether or not it might be moved back; if a subject is “highly unlikely to be permanent” - and in my experience, a smallish piano on wheels positioned on a flat surface is (or at least believing in the judgement of the reviewer that it is meant to be moved is reasonable) - then it meets rejection criteria. This same logic applies to an award-winning food truck, or a painting on the side of a train car sitting on rails, or a traveling circus, all of which might meet acceptance criteria and might have a “primary” location, but none of which overcomes rejection criteria.

  • MargariteDVille-INGMargariteDVille-ING Posts: 2,728 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I would not be bothered in the slightest about approving the piano in the music room.

    I disagree with approving classroom items, like the piano in a music room. Why stop with the piano - there are, by definition, lots of instruments there. It's like nominating the wipeboard in a math classroom, anatomical models in a medical classroom, tools in a carpentry shop classroom.

  • PinkSn0rlax-PGOPinkSn0rlax-PGO Posts: 16 ✭✭

    I had something similar happen to me. The hospital system I have worked at for over a decade has a "Healing Alcove" in one of its lobbies that has a Baby Grand piano in it for people to play. It's been there, unmoved for at LEAST 13 Years, probably longer. I submitted an appeal and it was rejected for Temporary when it's clearly not.

    Information submitted and appealed and rejected.

    Description

    This baby grand piano is available for the public to use to play relaxing, healing music during staff breaks or after patient appointments in the Healing Arts Alcove adjacent to the main T Tower lobby on the ground floor

    Location

    3841 Piper St, Anchorage, AK 99508, USA

    Supplemental Information

    It's on a 3 story public lobby with a patio & is nestled among a cafe, lovely patio & stream, & beautiful art & plants for the public to enjoy. This is a PUBLIC space accessible by foot and is NOT seasonal. The piano has been there for over a decade

  • jtgill-PGOjtgill-PGO Posts: 13 ✭✭

    To me there's no signage that shows that the piano isn't simply being stored there.

    You could just as easily have rolled it to that spot from down the hall and thrown it up in a staged photo to get a portal at your least favorite class (not accusing you just clarifying my perspective)

    The difference between it and an outdoor piano in say a park, or even one in a hotel lobby, is nobody stores a piano in a park or a lobby.

  • Janetx68-PGOJanetx68-PGO Posts: 82 ✭✭✭

    That seems like bending over backwards to declare something temporary. With all of that supporting signage, it's clearly as permanent as a painting hung on a wall or a statue.

  • X0bai-PGOX0bai-PGO Posts: 1,667 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I think the commenter you’re replying to was referring to the OP, not the newer piano.

    I don’t know what I’d do with the piano in the healing alcove. It is on wheels and the sign looks like it could be easily moved, but there is a sign and that’s something. I don’t much care for the primary image though; seems like the face of the piano is the keys, so this is kind of like taking a portrait of the back of someone’s head. I also wish I had a more definitive point of reference for the location; I can see it’s in a lobby but I probably can’t see that lobby from the map, which would give me pause. I might skip; I don’t have overwhelming confidence to vote for approval. I’m not even confident it meets criteria.

  • Leedle95-PGOLeedle95-PGO Posts: 605 ✭✭✭✭

    What is your rationale for why this piano in a lobby would be a great place to exercise, a great place to explore or a great place to gather socially?

Sign In or Register to comment.