Voting on Criteria or for Agreements?

RandomExploit-INGRandomExploit-ING Posts: 948 ✭✭✭✭✭

Just wondering on people's thoughts on if agreements or stats influence or have influenced how you vote?

It's something I never thought about before except for wondering if mass rejections were multiple people trying to get quick upgrades. But being fairly close to a badge in ingress for agreements I have watched stats a bit closer and caught myself about to make a decision based on getting an agreement rather than it's own merit.

It was a plain looking stone bridge, nothing special looking but it was on a trail. Being on a trail I would 5* it but figured most people would wrongly reject it. So I was left with decision to do what gets me closer to the next badge and keep my stats nicer by rejecting it for an agreement, or 5* on merit.

I gave it the 5* it deserved but got me wondering how these factors affect voters and the overall acceptance/rejection rates.

Thoughts?

Comments

  • 26thDoctor-PGO26thDoctor-PGO Posts: 4,924 ✭✭✭✭✭
  • Bidoofie875-PGOBidoofie875-PGO Posts: 5 ✭✭

    I guess bc I’m new to this I am always trying my best to rate everything according to the guidelines that I remember. My agreement rate seems like less than 50% which I find frustrating but your post is helping me understand more.

  • Hosette-INGHosette-ING Posts: 3,469 ✭✭✭✭✭

    100% for criteria. I occasionally skip things that I know the masses will review incorrectly.

    @Bidoofie875-PGO Remember that your total reviews will include some number of things you've reviewed but there haven't been enough votes to determine the outcome yet. That process can take hours to months. There's no way to know how many are situations where you've disagreed vs. how many don't have a resolution yet.

  • Gazzas89-PGOGazzas89-PGO Posts: 2,619 ✭✭✭✭✭

    95% guidelines, 5% post boxes

  • Shilfiell-INGShilfiell-ING Posts: 1,560 Ambassador

    In my area, there's been a push by a few reviewers to get many more agreements as quickly as possible, mainly by approving marginal-or-lower candidates. As a result, my rating has dropped to Good after being in Great status consistently prior to this shift. Numerous PRP candidates, generic businesses meeting no criteria, and memorial plaques for deceased nursing home residents have appeared in game: I can only work to remove those on PRP or school grounds. I'm not reviewing differently. I'm reviewing based on the criteria, and I do check daily for updates. What I AM doing is reviewing less, caring less, and growing more frustrated.

  • Elijustrying-INGElijustrying-ING Posts: 5,483 Ambassador

    @RandomExploit-ING

    Interesting topic you have raised.

    i’m not hugely interested in getting badges/levels I’m not constantly checking progress. But I do recognise that response when you find yourself close to a finish line to suddenly focus on a push to cross it. The only close example I have when I do watch something increasing is the upgrade icon. Because my local area takes over 27 months to resolve upgrades are very precious. It also means that my other numbers are pretty useless as I don’t know how many of the reviews I have done have yet to resolve - something I review today may not resolve for over another 2 years. I have only a vague idea of how the local area actually votes - but take note of specifics like red objects for posting letters older than 1952 are solid accepts ( just to balance out @The26thDoctor-PGO 🤪)

    So criteria is the only solid guide I have along with judgement and looking for the good about a submission.

    i would like to know the true rate of how my reviewing is going a tally that shows resolved and outstanding, what happens with edits and photos.

    A heat map of maybe level 7 cells showing some rates may prove interesting but there may be too much noise in the data.

  • Quinchapeces-PGOQuinchapeces-PGO Posts: 21 ✭✭

    I try to vote on criteria, but being more flexible in locations where there are not a lot of wayspots, specially rural ones.

  • AScarletSabre-PGOAScarletSabre-PGO Posts: 754 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I often have wondered myself if people are more interested in getting agreements or actually meeting criteria. Niantic's lack of communication has also meant new rulings on criteria take a while to filter through. A number of things nominated by myself and others within my community which I feel should have been accepted got rejected, seemingly because people are more concerned about how their rating will be affected than actually following the criteria.

    There are a lot of people who seem to want to try and preempt or otherwise predict how other people are going to rate an item. It is annoying. Like when I had that unique village bakery nomination which people kept rejecting, and now that space has been filled by a comparatively boring (but nonetheless still perfectly valid) parish notice board.

  • RandomExploit-INGRandomExploit-ING Posts: 948 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Some interesting comments and insights, thanks!

    Another thing that bothers me is how my agreements are only just over half of what I have voted for (60% maybe). It seems insane that roughly half of what I vote on, others vote the opposite way.

    Knowing the criteria well I would have thought maybe one in seven could be voted either way/ be borderline but the almost 50/50 stat still boggles my mind.

  • 26thDoctor-PGO26thDoctor-PGO Posts: 4,924 ✭✭✭✭✭

    That seems about normal?

    I was usually around about the same and anytime I've seen someone post their stats it's usually in the 50-70% range.

  • Hosette-INGHosette-ING Posts: 3,469 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @The26thDoctor-PGO There's a lot of space between 50% and 70%. In most cases I would expect a solid reviewer who has done a lot of reviews (10K or more, say) to be 60% or more.

  • SeaprincessHNB-PGOSeaprincessHNB-PGO Posts: 1,608 Ambassador

    I vote based on how I think it meets the criteria, though I am more lenient than a lot of the people who participate in this forum. I am not interested in being a gatekeeper. Due to a problem with changing the email attached to my account, I had my reviewing history wiped out and have had to rebuild it all. The one good part of that is my entire reviewing history does not reflect my "learning" period - it's all from after I had learned what I was doing. I say all that because my agreement rate is 85% which is very high based on what I've seen from other people. So I feel like even though I review for criteria, I have fairly decent proof that about 85% of other reviewers do the same.

  • 26thDoctor-PGO26thDoctor-PGO Posts: 4,924 ✭✭✭✭✭
  • Hosette-INGHosette-ING Posts: 3,469 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @SeaprincessHNB-PGO How are you calculating that? Is it based on the stats on your profile (total reviews, accepted, rejected, duplicated) or something else?

  • rufoushumming-PGOrufoushumming-PGO Posts: 1,435 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 2023


    @RandomExploit-ING I vote by criteria. I am not sure how the system works. And rating is still good.

    but speaking for myslef 50% of reviews have resulted in an agreement of which only 50% are accepted the others a mix 2/3rds rejected (of which the 99.999% are probably state survey markers that I fail but everyone else accepts by ignoring the criteria :-) and 1/3rd duplicates (which I don't understand as I think I am pretty good on this one! :-) But clearly not as good as I thought - hee hee.

    I cannot see rejection affecting an agreement as I got my badge way back when and I still review. For me it is about the review not the badge.

    BUT Do I think people game the system to get their badge or to facilitate their chosen POI type to be accepted. 100% yes

    That should not stop you reviewing by criteria. It just depends what you want. Do the right thing. It will be fine. Don't hold back. If you judge correctly by criteria it should not impact you in any way. IMOH.

  • Gazzas89-PGOGazzas89-PGO Posts: 2,619 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Bear in mind, your reviewed number includes edits and photos (at least I think it does photos), so that will bring your percentage down a bit. On my pokemon go reviews I'm on 65% agreements and on my ingress reviews I'm on 64% (though my pokemon go one has 1298 accepted and 699 rejections, while my ingress one is 833 accepted, 865 rejected, so it seems my pokemon go reviewing gets better nominations lol)

  • Gazzas89-PGOGazzas89-PGO Posts: 2,619 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Nowadays duplicates are a lot rarer as people tend to know about ingress portals and pokemon go even shows you where waypoints not in pogo are. Only time I get stuff rejected as duplicate for me is if I appealed one and the appeal went through before one i resubmitted got voted on or vice versa

  • Elijustrying-INGElijustrying-ING Posts: 5,483 Ambassador

    That’s interesting what you observe about duplicates.

    As you are roughly 120 miles north of me, my regular review pool will overlap along the Scottish Borders, and only fast track ones beyond. To the south I pick up chunks of London.

    However the number of duplicates I get has grown. I have put this down to the length of time it is taking in some of the areas I review to be resolved. I have had several of my own that have ended up as duplicates.

    For example I had reviewed a mosaic somewhere around 18 months or more ago the picture and write up were poor, passable but poor and in danger of failing. I had no idea if this had actually failed or was in the system still. Recently I explored that area - challenge to find 10 POI to make a 3rd gym. I made a good submission and just before I was going to upgrade it was approved. This happens repeatedly

    So I think time in the system and no way of knowing if someone has one in process cause duplicates to grow.

  • Hosette-INGHosette-ING Posts: 3,469 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Gazzas89-PGO Like @Elijustrying-ING I've seen a lot of duplicates recently too... my recent agreements are more than 8% duplicate. I suspect it's a combination of people submitting the same thing multiple times and multiple people submitting something new that showed up like a new sculpture.

  • Gazzas89-PGOGazzas89-PGO Posts: 2,619 ✭✭✭✭✭

    To be fair, I don't review as much as I used to, due to upgrades not being needed much anymore (plus my previous complaints of upgrades being more chances to be rejected), so maybe the duplicates are being done before I review them. I think last time I did a set of reviews I got about 5 duplicates from about 100 reviews, I do know 2 were in big city centers so that made sense as lots of people probably submitted them

  • RandomExploit-INGRandomExploit-ING Posts: 948 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I go through little spurts of voting but being close to the badge has made me vote more often. Once I have the badge I doubt I'll stop voting on wayfarer but I will probably go back to my previous levels.

    Personally I don't find it fun like some do. It's more a case of me wanting to give something back to the system because other people vote on my submissions.

    I guess my initial realisation made me think that people might vote for agreements and that is why some of my stuff used to get rejected. With footpaths In green areas being deemed ok by Niantic now, I'm sure many would still reject either through not knowing or rejecting to keep agreements ok. Either for general stats reasons or upgrades.

    Some people do keep an eye on their stats, this thread has shown me that and some are proud of them/want to keep them nice. It's like another mini-game 😉

    As for duplicates, I think there are a few reasons we see more. If I submit something nearer London that takes 2+ years to go through, it's likely other people have submitted in the two years before or two years after, because it was still not in the games.

    Another reason is people are trying to squeeze more POI in to areas that are well populated and are pushing their luck/the boundaries a bit. I have seen a stadiums name sign but the stadium was already a POI for example. Or a different entrance to a community hall and giving it a different name.

    It's no surprise that someone who likes making triangles or tries to get better IVs is also in to the stats side of wayfarer 😁

  • Hosette-INGHosette-ING Posts: 3,469 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @SeaprincessHNB-PGO Is that the one that calculates it based on upgrades? If so it gives much higher numbers than the sum of agreements divided by total reviews.

  • cyndiepooh-INGcyndiepooh-ING Posts: 1,319 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I think my post about disc golf courses shows what camp I am in. I vote criteria every time I can figure it out. So many gray areas.

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