Forced in-game codename display for Ingress-submitters
Johnsonsine-ING
Posts: 417 ✭✭✭✭
We agree this was recently rephrased, right?
I am positive it used to say 'in Wayfarer and Niantic games' but I'm not sure I got a screenshot of that (didn't see this coming unfortunately).
But this quite serious. This means Ingress-based Wayfarer users will always have to be "exposed" on the portals they submitted, when those pop up in Ingress?
Really? Why do only PoGo players get to have that privacy option?
Accepted Wayspots displaying your codename can be a fun chance to 'show off' your Wayfarer finds/achievements. But they can also give away your location quite a lot. Not everyone wants that, for whatever reasons - some quite serious - and this needs to be understood and respected.
Do I just stop submitting then? Is that my only choice, when I don't want my name plastered over a certain area? Wow. Please change this (back?) ASAP, Niantic. Then we'll pretend it never happened...
Comments
You're right in saying that it used to say "and Niantic Games".
Regardless, nominations submitted via Ingress always showed the agent name anyway and toggling the codename display to try to hide Ingress agent names never worked. So I guess they rephrased that option to accept that it doesn't even hide the in-game codename in Ingress.
But it has never worked in Ingress. Rather than fix their code, they "fixed" their text.
Altho they can't fix email text, like saying your edits can be viewed on your Contribution page, and your Wayspot was not accepted but it could appear in game in 48 hours.
It's a mess.
I feared this was the case. Thank you for the link though.
THIS. Every single word.
It's the Niantic Way, apparently. 😔
Does anyone know exactly when this was changed/rephrased?
It's not like a lot of info is coming our way generally, so...
@NianticAaron @NianticCasey-ING @NianticTintino-ING (I don't know, just randomly tagging...): Why don't Ingress-based Wayfarer submitters deserve privacy? It makes no sense. I would really love to hear your thoughts behind the recent changes, including the decision to change the wording in Wayfarer instead of adding an actual privacy option for Ingress submitters. Thanks.
bump
Sorry man... we Ingress players always get the short end of the stick.
It is a totally ridiculous situation.
What's even more ridiculous is the total silence from Niantic. I don't know what more to do or where to go with this. Trust issues with Niantic all-over the place now, this is far from the only situation where I have mentioned issues with personal data that I have shared (because it is mandatory for using their product) and then those data are still shared or kept, against my will, even when I have withdrawn my consent or, in this example here, asked to have a pricacy option that exists for players in their other game.
I love this hobby that is Wayfarer, but I feel more and more like I can't do this safely, data-wise. Have considered quitting all of this completely, and this is not said to put pressure on anyone in Niantic (clearly they don't even read this anyway), it's just to say to others: Think about what you say yes to. It's not just the obvious 'thrill' of sharing your location data here. You can't withdraw your consent - even though it is illegal to deny users that withdrawal.
The Ingress team may think that since Ingress is so open that the codename is displayed in the action log, there is no need to protect the submitter's codename.
Maybe. But when we are specifically talking about Wayfarer and not the Ingress game, I don't see why the option shouldn't be there.
The Wayfarer team is aware of this and you'll note it's something the Ambassador group has pushed for.
Out of pure speculation, it's important to remember that photo credit was always part of Ingress and a later feature added into PoGO quite a while after PoGO Wayfarer access added. I suspect more concern for youth who had nomination access and just lack of initial coding set-up are hold-ups in implementing privacy in Ingress.
We'll continue pushing it, but also remember that it requires action from the Ingress team in both accepting it as a problem and determining a solution.
First of all, thanks for all the work you Ambassadors do. Nothing but respect and graditude for that.
I wish it wasn't necessary though, that Niantic would fix things without tons of people having to yank their sleeve constantly.
I remember when Wayfarer access was granted to PoGo players. I had just reached lvl 40 and was quite curious and excited about it. This was the beginning of my personal Wayfarer adventure. This was in the fall of 2019. Almost 4 years ago! It's not like they haven't had time to do something. And that's part of the general problem, IMO. Obvious problems with the games and Wayfarer are just left unattended for years, directly hurting the experience users have with the games and Wayfarer. And communication is sparse and often very hard to find. I find it very hard to keep the enthusiasm intact at this point, personally. I don't want to be a Negative Nancy, but I also do not want to keep "yelling into a pillow".
@NianticAaron @NianticTintino-ING @NianticEveryone (I don't know who's who...)
Would you please say something about this already. We noticed the changed wording, obviously. We are wondering Ingress submitters can not be granted the privacy option that PoGo submitters can have?
Help me/us understand why we can't submit things and then have the option to be anonymous, like in PoGo and like it should be, but instead we HAVE to get our name on every single portal that comes from a submitted Wayspot? So that all other Ingress players get to see where we move around most... It's very unsettling as not everyone who plays Ingress play in the best way. Let's just put it like that.
It's frustrating and confusing that many posts are left ignored and unanswered, I have to say that too. I don't know if you guys are understaffed or if you're just ignoring certain posts, hoping the posters forget about it...? It's not great either way.
Thanks.
Time to bump again, I guess.
@NianticAaron @NianticTintino-ING @NianThib @NianticLC @NianticOren @NianticRN @NianticPleaseGetAGeneralTag...
I hate multi-tagging, so I am sorry for that. BUT I also hate when the team ignores important posts from the community. This is definitely an important post, as it has to do with your users' (lack of) privacy options. It also has to do with poor communication. Again, no idea why this is being ignored, so this will obviously affect the amount of patience and understanding one has here.
Could you at least please say if you are discussing this in your team or anything?
I am still very curious to know why you changed the wording instead of fixing the problem. Meaning: Instead of actually providing the option to be anonymous on Ingress portals, you just changed to wording in the Wayfarer settings. Can you understand why this offends a lot of people? Especially when ZERO communication comes along with the change?
Please, respond or escalate this or just do something that will solve this issue. Thank you.
Maybe it's not about being legal or ethical - maybe it's about what they can let slide while they put out fires somewhere else. A lot of their other bugs are also unethical, like making some areas' nominations wait 18 months while others take days, and lying/misleading Wayfarer emails. Hiring more developers is... well the opposite direction from how the industry is going.
I love Wayfaring, and try to overlook that this company just doesn't run like an ordinary company.
They have that renegade startup mentality: run around and do what you want - someone else will buy you up and mop up all the glaring unbusinesslike areas you didn't want to mess with. I don't think Niantic is for sale - I think they have the first part of the startup mentality, without the carrythru to being a responsible corporation.
This has been escalated directly to the Wayfarer team and elsewhere that Ambassadors have had contact.
I think the unspoken answer here is "It's not a Wayfarer issue." I understand headway is difficult to make anywhere in Niantic, but you'll have better luck posting to the Ingress forum and bringing it to their product developers.
I appreciate your response, but if that is the case, that is not acceptable. It is definitely a Wayfarer issue; I as a Wayfarer user have privacy problems (to put it mildly!) because of the way Niantic is handling the link between Wayfarer and Ingress.
I also doubt I will have more luck in the Ingress forums; at least here I have experienced getting an answer from an acutal team member. That has never happened to me in the Ingress forum... Which is also a problem, yes.
Unspoken answers are also not good enough. This is about the privacy of their users. While it may not be privacy in the terms of how they store your data (which we already know they will do even if they no longer have the right to do so!), it is still definitely location data being shared against users' will to a high degree.
That one has to FIGHT like this to even get an answer from ANYONE at Niantic, well that is worrying.
The fact that I posted this on July 15th and am STILL being ignored is just insulting.
Have you even tried posting in the Ingress forums? What was the response there? Did they call it a Wayfarer issue and direct you to come back here?
I have "even" tried posting in the Ingress forum about other things, yes. Never an answer from anyone with Niantic. I can't see why this should be different, so I won't even try.
I think you're probably right they will call it a Wayfarer issue and direct me back here.
And you know what, if THIS team HERE in Wayfarer think this is an Ingress issue, they should at least answer me with that. But they don't answer with anything. They just ignore my posts. This is a general problem.
Aaaaaaaaaaaaand still silence.
I wonder if Niantic even gives a damn about this?
Username masking has been in PoGo a couple years now (I think), but not Ingress. This post is months old. I think we have the answer to whether they give a damn.
I guess it's not part of Niantic's "Safety Center", https://nianticlabs.com/news/trustandsafety?hl=en which includes:
product designers partner with our Trust and Safety team early in the development process to understand and mitigate the types of risks that players may encounter while playing our games and using our products- before those products even get built.
Seems that games that are already built, are exempt.
Maybe legally it's fine: because it's username, not real name? If there are no legal ramifications, it will probably never get changed.
Remember this is the company that has probably sent tens (or hundreds) of thousands of emails per day, for 22 months and counting, saying you can view your Edits on your Contribution page. And other inaccuracies. There's no legal ramification for incorrect emails or username masking - and they don't seem to care about corporate image, or volunteer satisfaction. So why pay developers to do something that doesn't matter (to them)?
Actions speak louder than words. With lack of actions and lack of words, you can also draw conclusions.
@NianticAaron @NianticTintino-ING @NianThib @NianticLC @NianticOren @NianticRN.
Can ambassadors do something? Desperate here...
We have mentioned it several times. Have you had a response on the Ingress forums?
@Johnsonsine-ING has tried everything as far as I can tell. And the Ambassadors continue to try our best. I firmly believe this is a really important issue and am frustrated at how difficult it is to get this resolved in a timely and satisfactory way. Will keep at it.
I agree that someone from Niantic should reply here, although as others have stated I expect that their response will be that this is an Ingress issue.
After all I think that anyone should have very little privacy expectations while playing Ingress as it openly broadcast almost any action so probably showing the codename is an insignificant point with no priority to be changed at all.
But they should acknowledge it and say so.