Disc Golf
RobertHiggins-PGO
Posts: 123 ✭✭✭
I am going to get this subject started again. Blame my Nephew and his two friends avid Pokemon and disc golf Players. All three tell me they don't like setting up Pokéstop because of the confusion of the acceptable and not acceptable. Neater here nor there to me. But they went out of town to play disc golf this weekend. Came back upset at Pokémon players. I will not tell you that they went to Atlanta Georgia. They said the problem started on the second stretch. There where people walking down the fairway looking at their phones. So much that that could not start the hole. With nine teams behind them they had to rush the hole. Then some where later the Pokémon players were standing around a basket. While the team ahead of them were trying to make their second shot to the basket and refused to move. They tell me this happened more then three times that day. I understand playing Pokémon is fun. But these guys drove a few hundred miles to play a tournament. Okay no money was involved but these guys looked forward to this day for a few months. Seems like the these two activities ment to get people out and moving around should not interfere with each other.
It is not a safety thing it's an interference thing.
Unlike basketball, baseball, football, soccer, and these type of field sports. The Pokéstops are being placed in the field of play not behind the basket, plate, goal, or out of the play area.
As far as I am concerned if it is not the sign to shows the whole corse and not on the corse that will interfere with the players it should not be nominated!
Comments
Guidance used to be sign for whole course or if no sign first tee only, but sadly guidance has disappeared and people are nominated every basket/hole.
It’s a public park, yes?
With that thinking I should be able to go to public golf courses and stop every hole. TRUE?
I am thinking this should be changed are we really wanting to get other gamers upset at the Pokémon community? What happens when these players start to complain to the parks? The parks spend money to put up the disc courses. Some received money from local donors. They will not like the I deal of having that wrecked.
Sadly Niantic deliberately removed most of the criteria guidance. It should be common sense not to put wayspots in places where they interfere with other games but people seem to nominate anything they think might get them a stop.
I think we should stop approving them!
I’m going to tag @cyndiepooh-ING as I know she has raised issues about these repeatedly. Unfortunately I don’t think you ever got a full answer.
Disc golf is not something I come across much in the U.K. but I think we can happily ignore the word disc. I still go with the guidance that a golf course the whole course is one field of play. It’s not unusual for the starting point to be point of each hole to be nominated but I have never seen the actual green and hole submitted so I have no idea why people would submit the basket which seems very silly as it would cause interference by being in the vicinity.
There is a separate issue about accessibility. In the U.K. it is very common for footpaths to cross a course. And I can see that if these disc courses are in public parks where people are free to walk then there is a risk that there may be interference with play. You would hope common sense and respect would keep this to a minimum.
But having these baskets as wayspots seems to just ask for problems.
Getting them removed once approved appears to be very difficult.
@RobertHiggins-PGO the Disc-Golf players that are not amused should talk to the owner of the place. He then can have Niantic remove the wayspots.
Personally i always thought that Disc-Golf is a no-go for pokemon go. These "holes" shouldnt be wayspots. Niantic should just remove them for safety. The day will come that disc-golf and Pgo Players will have a brawl, or someone gets hurt by a flying disc in the head, or a disc-golf player gets attacked by a wild mankey.
... no? A public park is where the public are expected to walk around, a golf course, public or not, people are not expected to walk around the course.
That being said, the guidance is
Sign for the course, if not got one
Map for the course, if not got one
First tee
And if there's anything exciting about a particular hole (like, it's got something g special about it) that
here is the answer i got when i began bringing up this issue: https://community.wayfarer.nianticlabs.com/discussion/comment/158395#Comment_158395
if you don't want to follow the link, Giffard said
If any generic golf holes were nominated they would not meet our criteria for eligibility. Having said that, we have already reviewed the tickets raised and have addressed them accordingly. Sadly, we won't be able to discuss our internal policies.
so they aren't acceptable, but they would not remove them for me. when i get them (individual tees or baskets) to review, i mark them as unsafe. those are not plastic frisbees like you see on the beach that people are using. i get a lot of disagreements on those.
@RobertHiggins-PGO have your friends contact the course manager. niantic will remove them if the property owner complains.
I find the philosophy very strange: that Niantic can intrude anywhere, put a virtual item anyplace - and it's up to the real-world property owner to notice, understand, and complain. It's ok to draw people where they are not wanted, to interfere with the purpose of a place that someone else paid to build. The owner gets the extra expense of having to fight a battle they did not invite, to protect what they're trying to do, against something invisible that came out of nowhere to affect their livelihood or cause.
Some things are built for the general public. Some don't want every passerby hanging around.
I have family that has played disc golf on and off, and I concur that the discs are not the cheap, easily breakable plastic. They are made of more durable materials, and can be more like discuses, but lighter. Yes, a golf ball is light, but once hit, it can hurt someone, hence why you don't hit when someone is on the fairway. I can certainly see the issues with safe pedestrian access and game interference, especially with the baskets.
The one disc golf course I've been by a good deal just has a Wayspot at the starting tee; it's in a local park that has plenty of other Wayspots at the playground, picnic pavilions, swimming pool, basketball court, etc. A Little Free Library was recently put up near the playground at said park, so I nominated that, and it was accepted. Since there are Wayspots already crossing the course, I feel the park is pretty covered, and there's no guarantee that any of the tees/baskets for the disc golf course will be approved, or even appear in any of the games.
Here is the problem with this thinking. Now the disc players have to research to find the people in charge of the course. Then write a formal complaint to them. Then they will have to get permission from some board to contact Pokémon. Of which they have to research and find out that Pokémon is a Niantic, Wayfarer or someone. Then have you ever tried to contact Niantic, Wayfarer directly about anything? A locked account, a missing password, bought a new phone can't get your Pokémon account to come up in the new phone. We could stop this here and now by just saying NO! On the holes of Disc Golf. Or is the Pokémon community so arrogant as to say we don't care if we interfere with other people activities. 🤔
The problem with this thinking is you overestimate the number of reviewers who visit this forum. I’m guessing 10% of reviewers have ever visited this forum. Much less keep up with all the heated arguments about what should be accepted and what shouldn’t.
well, Niantic acted pretty quickly when i told them that someone is submitting the targets (plastic animals) on a hunting range (!)
They CAN if they see the danger. They somehow cannot think that a pokemon go player gets hit deadly by a plastic disc on disc golf.
I do know there's a danger, my son plays and throws with astonishing speed at times - but the main reason these individual tee/basket Disc Golf wayspots annoy me is because they essentially say "My game is more important than yours" to all Disc Golf players. Yes, many of these courses are in public parks, and they have walking access in between each tee or hole - but the same could be said for baseball fields, and we don't go placing Wayspots on each base or outfield wall. I really think Niantic needs a dedicated form to report over-submitted Disc Golf courses for reduction/removal, so that Wayfarers can proactively reduce conflict between players of different games and lessen the chance of injury in their own playerbase.
I think 10% is overly generous. I would guess 1% or maybe 2%.
Hummm!
I guess they are waiting for a knock down drag out to happen somewhere! When someone gets hurt then who get blamed. The golfers or the Pokémon players? The Parks Officials or Niantic Wayfarer? It would be a no Brainer to the lawyers. I think because we have a way to fix it here. I love Pokémon and do not play disc-golf. But will not go on a disc-golf corse to play Pokémon it is just WRONG to purposely interfere with others enjoy themselves. If it is not at the beginning. Showing the hole 🕳 it's a unsafe, sensitive just no POI to me.
Totally frustrating that pogo players were interrupting a tournament event at a frisbee golf course. However insert x activity with oblivious and rude players and you have the same problem. Trails are very popular with nominations right, well trails are also very popular as race courses. What's the bar for safety/usability of waypoints in areas that are used for other events. Players of all the games need to be respectful, there's almost always tons of places to play if there's a crowd at a location.
I don't believe individual tees should be accepted, and holes especially shouldn't. But the sign, the map or the first tre should 100% be in, I don't k ow about anywhere else, but all the disc/Frisbee golf's I k ow of are in public parks or in a bit of land expected to be used for cycling round and walking round. The rule is the disc golfers wait for the area to be clear, they do not just play and then blame people in tbe way. The one I submitted and had pass, it's the first tee, it's also next to a band where people feed swans and ducks and the tee is right next tk a path, the rules on the first tee iterally state "make sure the game areas are clear of people and animals before you throw"
So what you are saying the golfers should not play their game that is confined to that location. ( can't move the hole) because Pokémon players want to stand there to spin a Pokéstop? That doesn't seem fair. 😕
I admit I may have read this wrong. Apologies for my confusion.
Foot traffic or races don't have hard disk being thrown through the air at incredible speeds. That could do real harm. I can see this making me stop throwing a disc but if I was still young enough to run. I think I could run around or by a group without accidentally hitting one with a cutting edge. I just saw my first dic today. Dang these things are tough with a edge. Not like a frisbee at all. It is over 55 yards from my house to my barn. My nephew through a disc today. From the house to the barn in the bar is a Alis Tractor made in the 70 good steel. Now has a dent. Trust me when I say it is not a safe place for a stop. Go to Walmart look at one of these disc then. Okay another disc-golf hole. Ducks or no
For a start, if your comparing disc golf to normal golf, you're getting it wrong, as most places disc golf's are in public parks, while golf courses are their own thing.
But second, I'm saying the 1st tee is the only one that could be a pokestop, but only off the sign or the map aren't there.
Third, why should pokemon go players not be allowed to play their game? Max they will be there for 10 minutes, so why can't they be allowed to play their game in a public area?
No one ever said that the Pokemon player should not be able to play their game but can they not play it right down the line where the disc players are playing
Third, why should pokemon go players not be allowed to play their game? Max they will be there for 10 minutes, so why can't they be allowed to play their game in a public area?
Those Pokemon players - can play elsewhere. Those playing Disc Golf have to play at that particular spot. My local park has public sports fields, but I don't see players of other games standing on those fields in the middle of the game claiming public right of access.
In my local park I've seen
Cricket player playing on a football pitch
Football platers playing I a basketball court
A game of rugby where the cricket pitch was
So yeah, people can play where they want
As for pokemon go players playing elsewhere, it'd a public park, of community day us happening then niantics whole "get out and play with other" is expected to be players in a park. If you're gonna go down the rabbit joke of "pokemon go players can play elsewhere" then why not remove every stop for that reason? Again it's a public park, most disc golf's are around d the public walkways, pokemon go players have just as much right as anyone else to play where they want so long as it's within the law
IMO, disc golf baskets are definitely NOT eligible for multiple reasons.
They are duplicates of the course. You don't get to nominate parts of a baseball field. The same should apply to disc golf course.
The baskets are unsafe locations. One is literally nominating the one thing that people throwing objects at. The target is being nominated.
Now, many disc golf course are in public parks and integrated amongst the park's fields and other activity areas. They're not segregated off by themselves. So you will see random people wandering onto a course. Because of this some may argue that the signs at the tee pads for each holes, showing the hole information and location of the basket, might be eligible as a "trail marker" or information sign. It's the one spot on the course that players are NOT throwing at.
Robert I agree that the discs can hurt people and I vote to reject golf holes as well. Niantic usually doesn't remove these locations once on the map though, so we need the players to stop being oblivious and rude and do not play in these locations when the intended user is using them. In general these wayspots cause problems because you have two different users potentially at the same time which does happen with almost all wayspots. Fire stations are probably the extreme of this issue so Niantic will always remove wayspots at fire stations.
It was very easy for me to google an email for the person to contact when I have done so. They responded to me quickly and Niantic removed the Wayspot quickly if they wanted it gone. In a couple of cases, they have just had raids turned off (at a church) and a gym demoted back to a Pokestop (at a sculpture on a disc golf course).