Athletic Field Location Edits during Reviews
Fisher6040-ING
Posts: 42 ✭✭
We've seen frequent edits by reviewers on athletic field nomination pin locations. Per Niantic Guidance, anywhere adjacent to the field of play but not ON the field of play is an eligible location. Can Niantic comment on why, for example, location edits during reviews from a sports field scoreboard location to a bleacher location are being accepted as the final location?
If there isn't some sort of manual review of location edits during the review, there really should be. Not all location edits are appropriately made and there is anecdotal evidence of some reviewers intentionally moving nominations to locations that will not generate in Pokemon Go out of spite for players of that game.
Best Answers
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Faversham71-ING
Posts: 704 ✭✭✭✭✭
You should never put the pin in the middle of a soccer pitch - it interferes with play (read the guidance!). Sports fields should have the marker on the boundary -behind a goal is a good place for soccer.
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FuzzySun-ING
Posts: 47 ✭✭✭
You're actually incorrecting things. Niantic says the marker should not be on the field of play.
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NorthSeaPoet-ING
Posts: 895 ✭✭✭✭✭
I'm not implying I know more than the submitter of a particular wayspot, or any wayspot.
I was just saying that goal posts or sidelines on a football (soccer) or rugby pitch makes more sense for the location pin rather than slap bang in the middle of the pitch. Just like the location for tennis courts would be better at the entrance as opposed to where the net is.
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Sugarstarzkill-PGO
Posts: 437 ✭✭✭✭✭
I feel like some people are misunderstanding or being intentional obtuse. I have definitely have things moved that were accurate and the new location on one, for example, was moved 5 feet back, into a different cell. I had placed it ON TGE BUILDING being nominated. It got corrected to five feet further back toward the center of the building. All we're saying is.. please stop moving stuff when it is already in a perfectly accurate location.
I've also had stuff incorrectly moved. One was a stone carving on a building which the picture showed was at the side entrance, and could be seen on the side entrance. It was moved to the front.
I don't know that its Ingress players. It could be clueless people that just like moving locations to where THEY think is best. Not realizing that it actually screws things up in some cases. The poster specifically mentions having pins moved to the center of sports fields even though this is wrong. People rejected this possibility but then a comment in this thread confirmed that THEY ACTUALLY DO just that.
Answers
Really? I'd heard and know people move waypoints to get stops in, hadn't heard of people doing it to block stops appearing
I've never known reviewers to move locations to block stops but a lot of us do move the location pin to the correct spot or where we believe is the correct spot if the pin isn't suspiciously misplaced away from the intended wayspot.
I don't think there are many reviewers that do it to be intentionally spiteful. Just a lot of players seem to believe that there's this conspiracy to ruin PoGo, which in turn adds more fuel to the proverbial fire that is Ingress vs PoGo.
It happened to me last week. Had a local park that contains two unique baseball fields. One I pinned behind the backstop and it slid through no problem.
Next one I pinned off the side of first base (off the play field) for two reasons. First was there was a parksign within 20m of the backstop already in game and second reason it was a fresh cell that could house a stop in go. It went through voting and never appeared in go or ingress. Thought ****....went back into my approved nomination and it was moved during the voting process.
Thing that bothered me the most was all the time all of you took to review it and the few that went the extra mile to move the pin to a point within 20m of another POI. What a colossal waste of everyone's time.
When there are any public access playing fields (always soccer here), I always move the needle to the center of the field. I actually correct the location on many submits. Seems like people in many cases uses the GPS location of their phone as the stop/portal, and not the object in the photo.
Often I see that the pin - if not in the center - is placed near street or homes, to get a home portal. In those cases I move it away. We need people on foot, not in cars or sofas, playing the game.
I do not reject those with the location a bit off - intentional or not, I just correct the location.
You should never put the pin in the middle of a soccer pitch - it interferes with play (read the guidance!). Sports fields should have the marker on the boundary -behind a goal is a good place for soccer.
I generally move it to a location on the boundary closest to where the submitter put the original pin.
You're actually incorrecting things. Niantic says the marker should not be on the field of play.
January 2020 update.
Proximity to live Wayspots
Do not move the marker away from where the object appears in real life.
In that case, if the submission is a football (soccer for the Americans) pitch but the photo is of the goal, surely the location should be on the goal, not in the middle of the pitch?
In my opinion, it's a tad silly having the location as in the middle of a pitch because that makes the wayspot inaccessible in the event of a game/match. As such, surely anywhere on the pitch, in this example, would still be accurate and could avoid players from interrupting a game/match?
A November 2018 AMA also says regarding sports fields “There needs to be a physical object that ties to the Portal, so players know where to expect it to be. Middle of a sports field is usually not a good location.”
So many reviewers will move to the goalpost or similar.
Pretty much this.
It makes more sense to have the location set on the goals or the sidelines anyway, that way players can't accidentally interrupt a match
Yes, in the case of the location changes occurring during review in at least our area, pins are being moved from an eligible location on the boundary to a different eligible location on the boundary.
Pin locations should ONLY be modified during review if the location is incorrect. For objects that can have more than one correct location under NIA guidance, simply put, don't think you k ow better than the submitter if they've already selected an eligible location for the pin.
I'm not implying I know more than the submitter of a particular wayspot, or any wayspot.
I was just saying that goal posts or sidelines on a football (soccer) or rugby pitch makes more sense for the location pin rather than slap bang in the middle of the pitch. Just like the location for tennis courts would be better at the entrance as opposed to where the net is.
But sometimes there IS a better location. If someone puts the pin at the back of a church, for example, surely the entrance of the church would be more accessible. And with sports fields, Niantic have ruled they would like a physical object for the Wayspot, so a sign or goalposts may be better.
Sometimes submitters will choose a sub -optimal location just to force it to go through in PoGo. I guess it's reviewers discretion what they do, whether they allow it or move it to the optimal position.
Directly in the Wayfarer help, reviewers are assessing the following for location:
Rating Location Accuracy
Note: At times, you may not be able to view the Wayspot nomination in maps or street views if the real-world location of the nomination is inside a park or under a tree. For these cases, use your best judgement to decide whether the nomination could exist at the real-world location. You can use the submission photo and look for clues in the background to help you decide.
You're not being asked to select the correct location, only being asked to determine if the location is accurate or not. If it isn't, rate it accordingly and move on. You're not being asked to determine if it is the MOST accurate or BEST location, period. If it's eligible where it is, then leave it be.
I have, I'm not suggesting moves away from the object in real life. What I am asking is why reviewers feel the need on large objects, particularly sports fields but also buildings, to suggest a different location when the one selected by the submitter is eligible, located on the real-world object?
I don't have enough fingers anymore to count the number of ballfields where the pin has been moved to be on top of home plate when it was originally submitted with the pin on the side of the field. If it's an eligible location, 5*, move on.
@NicoSolheim-ING this is the kind of review sentiment I was referring to in my OP, though this response isn't on the malicious bent. A location may be "sub-optimal" for one game and not another, but that's very specifically not what Niantic has asked reviewers to assess in that section of the review. My complaint is against the reviewers who decide that the pin needs to be moved to a location optimal for their preferred game, even if that precludes it from being included in other games and even if the original location selected by the submitter is entirely eligible per Niantic guidance.
You seem to have a lot of negativity towards Ingress players for someone so apparently plays Ingress.
Please don't turn this into a PoGo v Ingress thing. Ultimately we need to pick the best option for a Wayspot regardless of games. We are all Wayfarers building the same POI network. And we shouldn't be allowing suboptimal locations if there's a better, easier to access place for Wayspot.
Also confused why you're mentioning swimming pools, Niantic have previously said swimming pools aren't good Wayspots anyway, and if any did get approved surely you're not suggesting the best, safest place for the marker is the middle of the pool?
I feel like some people are misunderstanding or being intentional obtuse. I have definitely have things moved that were accurate and the new location on one, for example, was moved 5 feet back, into a different cell. I had placed it ON TGE BUILDING being nominated. It got corrected to five feet further back toward the center of the building. All we're saying is.. please stop moving stuff when it is already in a perfectly accurate location.
I've also had stuff incorrectly moved. One was a stone carving on a building which the picture showed was at the side entrance, and could be seen on the side entrance. It was moved to the front.
I don't know that its Ingress players. It could be clueless people that just like moving locations to where THEY think is best. Not realizing that it actually screws things up in some cases. The poster specifically mentions having pins moved to the center of sports fields even though this is wrong. People rejected this possibility but then a comment in this thread confirmed that THEY ACTUALLY DO just that.
The examples you gave certainly don't seem like good reasons to move the marker, sorry that happened to you.
The odd thing is that it will take a lot of reviewers to move the location for it to get accepted in the new place, so to move a carving from it's exact location to a different place doesn't make sense. Was Street View up to date and accurate?
Stop lying. We can absolutely move submissions to wherever we think they are best at.
If that was the case, the suggest new location option wouldn't be so readily available when reviewing a nomination.
It is okay to move a marker to the correct location if it is in the wrong location. It is also okay to move a marker to the location Niantic has indicated is the appropriate location, like to the edge of an athletic field, especially where a permanent structure for that field is located. We should move markers away from the correct location. We should also not move markers if we are unsure of what the correct location is.
In fact, when Wayfarer first rolled out to PoGo players Niantic eventually had to make the "new location" button bigger cos so many new reviewers didnt know it was there! I heard of someone who did a thousand reviews before they noticed they were supposed to move the location if it was incorrect.
I don't disagree, but please read the original post. Reviewers absolutely MUST avoid thinking in a binary manner with regards to correct location. Anywhere on the boundary of a sports field is an eligible location per the wording of Niantic's clarifications. Therefore, there will not be "the correct" location but "many correct" locations, plural. Simply put, yet again, you shouldn't be suggesting different locations if the submitted location is already an eligible location.
@Senmana-ING the street view was up to date, and I agree it's odd multiple people must've moved it. I think some people just assume it should be at the front entrance of the building and glossed over my support info where I wrote that the engraving was on the side entrance? That's the only thing I could figure.