I was agreeing with @AisforAndis-ING on him being harassed. I do not support harassment of any kind I'm only looking for things to be fair I'm just looking for better communication so legitimate stuff doesn't get removed I mean it's pretty easy to ask someone if it's actually there
If there wasn’t abuse none of this would have happened to begin with. I have a huge network to report soon. I noticed it as I was driving through a city local to me that I am familiar with. When I get a chance to upload all of it I will. Not as many as @AisforAndis-ING reported but still a large network of fakes
@LiveFreeorCatch-PGO In my community we just make set rules as punishment for those to express this kind of behavior. Currently we have users banned for spoofing/submitting fake POI/ bullying/ etc the ban has an expiration date & said users are aware of it
Thanks for some of the insight. I don’t know how we can ban people but we do not allow our members to bully and harasss. Additionally there are so many people that play the game it’s hard to know who submitted what. I know our town has at least 3 other groups on top of team groups. I think what is really hard to understand is being painted with this broad stroke of abuse. I know I vote those down and tell people that these are not acceptable but then I am putting the blame on memebers that are not actually doing it. And that is not fair to them. We have put up the link for what is acceptable and what is not. Showed them what to look for and what the reviewers are looking for We also try to update when things change Like water fountains no longer being accepted
the real hard part is; we have already been all declared guilty for a few bad players. None of our work to rectify it from the community here has been acknowledged, commented or thanked. A lot of the posts are continued finger waving that we should have known better. Well we know, let’s work together I just really want to play and learn and make new friends
this is my third post asking for more teaching and understanding and I still have not been approached. So I don’t know if we are being taken seriously or if anyone wants to help out.
I hope you can understand where I am coming from just like I understand where you are coming from
I also recommend asking for users to post their submissions within the community. It will help as well. You’re very welcome!!! I hope you are feeling well. It sounds to me like you’re doing a great job so don’t blame yourself. From me personally congratulations on everything you have already done. It’s a lot of work & you can only do so much. Don’t blame yourself or the good people in your community & just do what you can. Don’t let it stress you. I hope your week is awesome as well. Reach out anytime. A link to my discord is visible on my profile. Anytime you wanna chat feel free to reach out
this is my third post asking for more teaching and understanding and I still have not been approached. So I don’t know if we are being taken seriously or if anyone wants to help out.
What kind of help do you need?
Do you want someone to go there and tell you if each nomination is valid? how to detect abuse?
You have the same forums as everyone else, post your questions if you have doubts, we can't read your mind.
@LiveFreeorCatch-PGO Although I follow the abuse issue with interest, I normally don't comment on these posts. However, as you asked for help on how to address this issue within your community I'll share my thoughts on this situation in particular.
The first thing you have to take into account is that people have varied motivations. Leaving aside the people who create fake wayspots, some people will see a fake, obsolete or rejectable wayspot and won't care but others will take action to correct it. Why they do it? In some cases because it's the right thing to do, but also because in games like Ingress it may benefit them game-wise to do it. So, sooner or later, wrong wayspots will be reported. If the local school somehow managed to become a gym, you can only blame yourself for ignore the problem and keep playing on it when it finally is.
The second thing you have to consider is that most "hardcore" wayfarers do it because they like to review and populate the map with good wayspots. The more you grow an abuse location, the more noticeable it becomes when reviewing nearby nominations. Sooner or later the abuse will be noticed and reported, it's almost inevitable.
Your community had a problem with wayspot nomination abuse. It grew so big that it became noticeable and ended up being reported. But nevertheless abusers kept on with it.Your whole community was tainted because of that. Most of you may not have been part of the abuse but probably turned a blind eye to the abusive locations.
So what can you do? Fix the problems yourselves. Start reporting the wrong wayspots in app locally. You're the only ones who can do it. Don't let the abuse problem persist. If abuse locations are taken down by the local community as soon as they go up, even the most persistent of abusers will give up.
So, that's my advice in a nutshell. take the issue on your hands and clean up your own town.
Thanks for the thoughtful and respectful discussion here. A special thanks to @AisforAndis-ING for all of the great documentation that you've done in this and the other threads. Any type of targeted harassment is absolutely against our player guidelines and, in addition to the reports of the nominations, I've also looped in our Trust and Safety department to take a look at this situation.
I hear you that this type of abuse of the system is frustrating and discounting the legitimate work that the majority of you are doing. I know that I've said this before, but I am actively talking with the Wayfarer team about these situations and they know the impact that this is having on you all both as reviewers and nominators. It's high on the team's priority list to work on, although it's no easy task to solve.
Finally, I'm interested to hear that some of you are showing interest in a program similar to the Ingress Vanguards or recently introduced XM Ambassadors program. This is something that we've discussed in the past, bringing in some community members to help augment efforts in the forum and strengthen our line to your feedback. Knowing that there are some of you who are interested in participating is helpful as we work on an initial design for such a program.
I'll follow-up with some more information about the situation once I hear back. Thanks again for your patience and understanding.
I'm sure I'm speaking for a lot of people on the forum when saying that a Ingress Vanguard-adjacent program for Wayfarer sounds very intriguing. Looking forward to hearing more about it, as well as other improvements related to reporting and dealing with abuse.
A Wayfarer vanguard role for trusted wayfarers can help all over the world. Every country got its own "strategies" to abuse the system. Mostly, local players can understand those kinds of abuse the best. If there will ever be such a program, you can count me in!
I also got the feeling, that the current abuse system is not working. I got abuse reports open for over two months while some reports I did a few weeks ago already got processed. Also, the forum needs a "clean up" sometimes, whats not that big kind of a deal for a vanguard.
Thank you for acknowledging the continued abuse and harassment, it is greatly appreciated. I also do think that some sort of program for trusted wayfarers would do a lot of good for the community.
@NianticCasey-ING I also sent you a message just now in relation to new evidence in regards to abuse/retaliation being committed against people from my area as a result of me reporting this abuse. It contained information that I felt was sensitive so I did not post it here. If you could let me know you received that in some capacity, I would appreciate it, that way I won't end up feeling like I need to make it public in this post for it to get noticed.
a program like this would change the way the game is today. I highly recommend it & I applaud the staff for working so fast. keep up the good work @NianticCasey-ING. I myself would be more than happy to help. I am not doing this for me. I am here for everyone else, to help better & make the platform better. We have to strategize together & as a team we can better strategize & work together to make the platform better. The opportunities are endless.
Initially the comment of hiring OP to work for you was meant as a joke and kind of a stab at how the community is much more capable of detecting and handling these things than the current WF team. But it actually worked! And as such, i will be the first to congratulate you on acknowledging this situation, and actively working to improve it! Good job!
This is precisely why a counsel has no appeal to me. Niantic has not demonstrated the ability to follow through on simple stuff like this where ALL the work has been done for them. Why do we have any faith that being part of a "special group" will make their responses any better?
It won't. Because it will be the counsil's responses. And the community has proven time and time again that they can do Nia's job better than them. Now, that's just going to be more free labor so they don't really care :D
Thanks a ton for flagging this, @AisforAndis-ING! I am also thankful to everyone for having a healthy discussion on this thread. Having said that, we have done a thorough investigation and taken action on 62 Wayspots and 23 Wayfinders in accordance with our policies. Let me know if there is anything else that needs our immediate attention related to this discussion, we'll be happy to take a look at it.
@NianticGiffard Congrats to you & the team. Good work. Also congrats to everyone here who helped in any way. We all make a difference. Stay positive & keep up the good work everybody
Comments
I was agreeing with @AisforAndis-ING on him being harassed. I do not support harassment of any kind I'm only looking for things to be fair I'm just looking for better communication so legitimate stuff doesn't get removed I mean it's pretty easy to ask someone if it's actually there
It's also really easy not to abuse the system to begin with.
If there wasn’t abuse none of this would have happened to begin with. I have a huge network to report soon. I noticed it as I was driving through a city local to me that I am familiar with. When I get a chance to upload all of it I will. Not as many as @AisforAndis-ING reported but still a large network of fakes
@LiveFreeorCatch-PGO In my community we just make set rules as punishment for those to express this kind of behavior. Currently we have users banned for spoofing/submitting fake POI/ bullying/ etc the ban has an expiration date & said users are aware of it
Thanks for some of the insight. I don’t know how we can ban people but we do not allow our members to bully and harasss. Additionally there are so many people that play the game it’s hard to know who submitted what. I know our town has at least 3 other groups on top of team groups. I think what is really hard to understand is being painted with this broad stroke of abuse. I know I vote those down and tell people that these are not acceptable but then I am putting the blame on memebers that are not actually doing it. And that is not fair to them. We have put up the link for what is acceptable and what is not. Showed them what to look for and what the reviewers are looking for We also try to update when things change Like water fountains no longer being accepted
the real hard part is; we have already been all declared guilty for a few bad players. None of our work to rectify it from the community here has been acknowledged, commented or thanked. A lot of the posts are continued finger waving that we should have known better. Well we know, let’s work together I just really want to play and learn and make new friends
this is my third post asking for more teaching and understanding and I still have not been approached. So I don’t know if we are being taken seriously or if anyone wants to help out.
I hope you can understand where I am coming from just like I understand where you are coming from
have a great week a d make it awesome
best
I also recommend asking for users to post their submissions within the community. It will help as well. You’re very welcome!!! I hope you are feeling well. It sounds to me like you’re doing a great job so don’t blame yourself. From me personally congratulations on everything you have already done. It’s a lot of work & you can only do so much. Don’t blame yourself or the good people in your community & just do what you can. Don’t let it stress you. I hope your week is awesome as well. Reach out anytime. A link to my discord is visible on my profile. Anytime you wanna chat feel free to reach out
this is my third post asking for more teaching and understanding and I still have not been approached. So I don’t know if we are being taken seriously or if anyone wants to help out.
What kind of help do you need?
Do you want someone to go there and tell you if each nomination is valid? how to detect abuse?
You have the same forums as everyone else, post your questions if you have doubts, we can't read your mind.
@LiveFreeorCatch-PGO Although I follow the abuse issue with interest, I normally don't comment on these posts. However, as you asked for help on how to address this issue within your community I'll share my thoughts on this situation in particular.
The first thing you have to take into account is that people have varied motivations. Leaving aside the people who create fake wayspots, some people will see a fake, obsolete or rejectable wayspot and won't care but others will take action to correct it. Why they do it? In some cases because it's the right thing to do, but also because in games like Ingress it may benefit them game-wise to do it. So, sooner or later, wrong wayspots will be reported. If the local school somehow managed to become a gym, you can only blame yourself for ignore the problem and keep playing on it when it finally is.
The second thing you have to consider is that most "hardcore" wayfarers do it because they like to review and populate the map with good wayspots. The more you grow an abuse location, the more noticeable it becomes when reviewing nearby nominations. Sooner or later the abuse will be noticed and reported, it's almost inevitable.
Your community had a problem with wayspot nomination abuse. It grew so big that it became noticeable and ended up being reported. But nevertheless abusers kept on with it.Your whole community was tainted because of that. Most of you may not have been part of the abuse but probably turned a blind eye to the abusive locations.
So what can you do? Fix the problems yourselves. Start reporting the wrong wayspots in app locally. You're the only ones who can do it. Don't let the abuse problem persist. If abuse locations are taken down by the local community as soon as they go up, even the most persistent of abusers will give up.
So, that's my advice in a nutshell. take the issue on your hands and clean up your own town.
Cheers,
Lechu
@TheZodiac007-PGO and @Lechu1730-PGO thank you for your responses. I’ll be definitely reaching out and your feedback was very much appreciated
Have a great week and hope to chat soon. Now to figure out discord lol
Best
Hey folks,
Thanks for the thoughtful and respectful discussion here. A special thanks to @AisforAndis-ING for all of the great documentation that you've done in this and the other threads. Any type of targeted harassment is absolutely against our player guidelines and, in addition to the reports of the nominations, I've also looped in our Trust and Safety department to take a look at this situation.
I hear you that this type of abuse of the system is frustrating and discounting the legitimate work that the majority of you are doing. I know that I've said this before, but I am actively talking with the Wayfarer team about these situations and they know the impact that this is having on you all both as reviewers and nominators. It's high on the team's priority list to work on, although it's no easy task to solve.
Finally, I'm interested to hear that some of you are showing interest in a program similar to the Ingress Vanguards or recently introduced XM Ambassadors program. This is something that we've discussed in the past, bringing in some community members to help augment efforts in the forum and strengthen our line to your feedback. Knowing that there are some of you who are interested in participating is helpful as we work on an initial design for such a program.
I'll follow-up with some more information about the situation once I hear back. Thanks again for your patience and understanding.
I'm sure I'm speaking for a lot of people on the forum when saying that a Ingress Vanguard-adjacent program for Wayfarer sounds very intriguing. Looking forward to hearing more about it, as well as other improvements related to reporting and dealing with abuse.
A Wayfarer vanguard role for trusted wayfarers can help all over the world. Every country got its own "strategies" to abuse the system. Mostly, local players can understand those kinds of abuse the best. If there will ever be such a program, you can count me in!
I also got the feeling, that the current abuse system is not working. I got abuse reports open for over two months while some reports I did a few weeks ago already got processed. Also, the forum needs a "clean up" sometimes, whats not that big kind of a deal for a vanguard.
Thank you for acknowledging the continued abuse and harassment, it is greatly appreciated. I also do think that some sort of program for trusted wayfarers would do a lot of good for the community.
@NianticCasey-ING I also sent you a message just now in relation to new evidence in regards to abuse/retaliation being committed against people from my area as a result of me reporting this abuse. It contained information that I felt was sensitive so I did not post it here. If you could let me know you received that in some capacity, I would appreciate it, that way I won't end up feeling like I need to make it public in this post for it to get noticed.
a program like this would change the way the game is today. I highly recommend it & I applaud the staff for working so fast. keep up the good work @NianticCasey-ING. I myself would be more than happy to help. I am not doing this for me. I am here for everyone else, to help better & make the platform better. We have to strategize together & as a team we can better strategize & work together to make the platform better. The opportunities are endless.
Initially the comment of hiring OP to work for you was meant as a joke and kind of a stab at how the community is much more capable of detecting and handling these things than the current WF team. But it actually worked! And as such, i will be the first to congratulate you on acknowledging this situation, and actively working to improve it! Good job!
This is precisely why a counsel has no appeal to me. Niantic has not demonstrated the ability to follow through on simple stuff like this where ALL the work has been done for them. Why do we have any faith that being part of a "special group" will make their responses any better?
It won't. Because it will be the counsil's responses. And the community has proven time and time again that they can do Nia's job better than them. Now, that's just going to be more free labor so they don't really care :D
Thanks a ton for flagging this, @AisforAndis-ING! I am also thankful to everyone for having a healthy discussion on this thread. Having said that, we have done a thorough investigation and taken action on 62 Wayspots and 23 Wayfinders in accordance with our policies. Let me know if there is anything else that needs our immediate attention related to this discussion, we'll be happy to take a look at it.
@NianticGiffard Congrats to you & the team. Good work. Also congrats to everyone here who helped in any way. We all make a difference. Stay positive & keep up the good work everybody