Hopefully, you are providing links or reference numbers in the supporting information to show that the buildings are actually listed for historic preservation?
Going to be hard to get it accepted, but good luck. I would probably avoid saying anything was past or present a public house just incase some reviewers get confused
Yes, links are provided. I may rename the first one to avoid confusion. Maybe to something along the lines of "Italianate-style Building". Perhaps it would be confusing otherwise.
You would have to provide a lot of good and compelling supporting information. Just because a building is "old" or "listed" does not exempt it from beeing assessed against the Niantic criteria. Expect a "no" for both if you submit.
When a building or object is listed, it is because the presiding government agency sees it as having historical, cultural, or architectural significance. I would take that as fitting the exploration criteria in spades.
Listed buildings are listed for a reason, not just because they are old. I've recently submitted 2 listed buildings, a grade c and a grade b, grade c listed building gs are of local importance either historical or artwork, grade b is the same except on a more national scale, admittedly the webpage on them doesn't actually explain what category they fall (historical or artwork) but the fact they are listed literally means they should pass because they are either/both historical or artistic
First all, any number of stars from 2*-5* will see a nomination accepted. It'll be rare that a nomination gets 5* from everyone. Only if 1* enough ratings are accumulated will a nominated be rejected. I am not expecting to get 5* from every single reviewer. If a person reviewing is only giving either 1* or 5* on nominations they review then that person is not reviewing correctly.
Secondly, I have filled in the history and architectural information, as seen the descriptions of the nominations. I have also included links which provide more supporting information (i.e. Historic England, which holds the listing entry),
Mines was based in Scotland, so yeah, might differ slightly, I I know of any grades that are numerical, outs are alphabet and as I said, based on historical or artistic importance at local, national and something else levels, ive seen a few Cs and 1 b in my area. Think a lot of bridges are grade c near me
The Grade I listing is awarded to buildings of exceptional interest, sometimes considered to be internationally important. To be listed at Grade II*, a building must be particularly important and of more than special interest. Grade II buildings, meanwhile, have been deemed nationally important and of special interest.
For Scotland
A, B and C.
Buildings of national or international importance, either architectural or historic, or fine, little-altered examples of a particular period, style or building type, are given an A listing. A building is given a B listing if it is of regional or more than local importance, or is a major example of a certain period, style or building type, which may have been altered.
Category C listed buildings in Scotland are those of local importance or lesser examples of a given period, style or building type, as originally constructed or moderately altered. A building may also be listed as C if it is a simple, traditional building that groups well with other listed buildings.
I think NI has a different system from both...
I've had a couple of listed buildings in Scotland rejected but I think they were more of a hard sell than anything else.
It's not an Infant School anymore but I don't think reviewers saw past that even though I pushed the architectural style and the buildings relevance and place in the local community :(
To revert back to OP's question - neither of those are extremely appealing as 'outstanding architecture'.
Being on a heritage list itself still is a bit of a doubt, as there's A LOT that's on such 'protection' lists. I'd need to be properly persuaded about the historic VALUE of the building rather then the historic NATURE of the building, if that makes sense.
Over here, valuable 'heritage' has a typical type of marker on the buildings - which mostly is considered to be proof it's something worthwhile / meaningfull rather then just old. Outside of the UK your 'grade II' reference holds little value. Guess it depends on where you're at if you get mainland reviewers.
"A Fine Example of Italianate Architecture" is a significantly worse title than your original. I would have called it "The Old Gin Palace", and taken a picture of the entire building.
The description is so full of cruft, clearly trying to pad it out. It's a trick, it's just not relevant. It's a Grade II listed building which isn't a private residence so it passes. Being Grade II listed makes it far more important historically than all the unlisted post boxes and stink pipes that British wayfarers embarrass themselves with.
Here is my last accepted listed building nom. I use the description to describe the place, not what the industrial revolution was. -
This is the supplemental photograph I used... and the top rejection reason given is "private residential property". So according to the reviewing public, a HSBC bank branch is somebody's single occupancy private reticence...
Point taken. I'll go back later this week and take a better photograph. I'll also think about the description and make the focus more on the building itself.
I think Page & Wells is more likely to pass because it is more visually distinctive. But yet again, I would take a picture of the whole building - it's more attractive on Google Maps - https://goo.gl/maps/4fMs9ZqmPwdci9odA, standing out particularly against the modern buildings next door.
Regional, that was it. I've got a couple of things in but I fully expect them to fail. A former school that was grade c and a former printers shop that was grade b. The school doesn't look especially interesting so it was of historical import I assume. The printer shop I'd defo say was for its importance.
Sure, many listed buildings will be private residences, within prison walls or perhaps even an inaccessible lighthouse, for example, so yes, not all will be appropriate to nominate. I only aim nominate listed buildings that not private residences and that are accessible to the general public. Thus, this eliminates huge chunks of the Historic England entries.
Buildings are listed because there is something special about them, but sure, some buildings have more of a story to them than others. I hope I can emphasise why the building I have nominated are architecturally noteworthy. As others have said, a building becomes listed because it is appreciated by the community. Maybe not all of the community, as is particularly the case with some of the1960s Brutalism that happens to be listed, but enough people decided that a building is worth saving.
Sadly, the first building was again rejected due to reviewers claiming it is a "private residential property". At least one person also said "does not meet criteria" too. There was no third reason given for reject, meaning only those two rejection reasons were given.
Comments
I don't see any pictures
I havent seen any before as well. But now I can see them.
Hopefully, you are providing links or reference numbers in the supporting information to show that the buildings are actually listed for historic preservation?
Going to be hard to get it accepted, but good luck. I would probably avoid saying anything was past or present a public house just incase some reviewers get confused
Yes, links are provided. I may rename the first one to avoid confusion. Maybe to something along the lines of "Italianate-style Building". Perhaps it would be confusing otherwise.
You would have to provide a lot of good and compelling supporting information. Just because a building is "old" or "listed" does not exempt it from beeing assessed against the Niantic criteria. Expect a "no" for both if you submit.
When a building or object is listed, it is because the presiding government agency sees it as having historical, cultural, or architectural significance. I would take that as fitting the exploration criteria in spades.
I wouldn't take a guy who believes a community centre is a terrible candidate for a Wayspot too seriously. Source: https://community.wayfarer.nianticlabs.com/discussion/comment/95353#Comment_95353
Listed buildings are listed for a reason, not just because they are old. I've recently submitted 2 listed buildings, a grade c and a grade b, grade c listed building gs are of local importance either historical or artwork, grade b is the same except on a more national scale, admittedly the webpage on them doesn't actually explain what category they fall (historical or artwork) but the fact they are listed literally means they should pass because they are either/both historical or artistic
I don't think that's exactly how it works in England. Ireland, Wales and Scotland may also have slightly differing systems of rating.
Grade I - Exceptional status. About 2% of listed buildings
Grade II* - Important status. About 5*
Grade II - Special interest about 90% of listed buildings.
I think it's also a way to protect them to stop Joe Public knocking down a wall etc.
I'm also not sure just a listing itself is enough to warrant a 5* pass.
If it's listed and you can fill in the story with the history or architectural info but just saying It's listed is, I don't think, enough.
First all, any number of stars from 2*-5* will see a nomination accepted. It'll be rare that a nomination gets 5* from everyone. Only if 1* enough ratings are accumulated will a nominated be rejected. I am not expecting to get 5* from every single reviewer. If a person reviewing is only giving either 1* or 5* on nominations they review then that person is not reviewing correctly.
Secondly, I have filled in the history and architectural information, as seen the descriptions of the nominations. I have also included links which provide more supporting information (i.e. Historic England, which holds the listing entry),
Yes. Generally speaking, historic buildings that are in good nick and are not commonplace in the region should be excellent candidates for Wayfarer.
This thread is highlighting a problem of some sort. I’m not sure if it’s a forum problem or with Wayfarer in general.
If everybody pauses and takes a deep breath, maybe we can sort it out….
Hope you’re all enjoying your weekend!
On the second bit, I know you did and thought it was great.
I was pointing out that just being listed and/or old isn't enough in itself.
I can find a load of listed and old things on HistoricEngland but I wouldn't submit them on that alone.
There's no evidence to this in fact...
This AMA states otherwise.
Mines was based in Scotland, so yeah, might differ slightly, I I know of any grades that are numerical, outs are alphabet and as I said, based on historical or artistic importance at local, national and something else levels, ive seen a few Cs and 1 b in my area. Think a lot of bridges are grade c near me
For England and Wales.
Grade I, Grade II* and Grade II.
The Grade I listing is awarded to buildings of exceptional interest, sometimes considered to be internationally important. To be listed at Grade II*, a building must be particularly important and of more than special interest. Grade II buildings, meanwhile, have been deemed nationally important and of special interest.
For Scotland
A, B and C.
Buildings of national or international importance, either architectural or historic, or fine, little-altered examples of a particular period, style or building type, are given an A listing. A building is given a B listing if it is of regional or more than local importance, or is a major example of a certain period, style or building type, which may have been altered.
Category C listed buildings in Scotland are those of local importance or lesser examples of a given period, style or building type, as originally constructed or moderately altered. A building may also be listed as C if it is a simple, traditional building that groups well with other listed buildings.
I think NI has a different system from both...
I've had a couple of listed buildings in Scotland rejected but I think they were more of a hard sell than anything else.
It's not an Infant School anymore but I don't think reviewers saw past that even though I pushed the architectural style and the buildings relevance and place in the local community :(
To revert back to OP's question - neither of those are extremely appealing as 'outstanding architecture'.
Being on a heritage list itself still is a bit of a doubt, as there's A LOT that's on such 'protection' lists. I'd need to be properly persuaded about the historic VALUE of the building rather then the historic NATURE of the building, if that makes sense.
Over here, valuable 'heritage' has a typical type of marker on the buildings - which mostly is considered to be proof it's something worthwhile / meaningfull rather then just old. Outside of the UK your 'grade II' reference holds little value. Guess it depends on where you're at if you get mainland reviewers.
"A Fine Example of Italianate Architecture" is a significantly worse title than your original. I would have called it "The Old Gin Palace", and taken a picture of the entire building.
The description is so full of cruft, clearly trying to pad it out. It's a trick, it's just not relevant. It's a Grade II listed building which isn't a private residence so it passes. Being Grade II listed makes it far more important historically than all the unlisted post boxes and stink pipes that British wayfarers embarrass themselves with.
Here is my last accepted listed building nom. I use the description to describe the place, not what the industrial revolution was. -
This is the supplemental photograph I used... and the top rejection reason given is "private residential property". So according to the reviewing public, a HSBC bank branch is somebody's single occupancy private reticence...
Point taken. I'll go back later this week and take a better photograph. I'll also think about the description and make the focus more on the building itself.
I think Page & Wells is more likely to pass because it is more visually distinctive. But yet again, I would take a picture of the whole building - it's more attractive on Google Maps - https://goo.gl/maps/4fMs9ZqmPwdci9odA, standing out particularly against the modern buildings next door.
Regional, that was it. I've got a couple of things in but I fully expect them to fail. A former school that was grade c and a former printers shop that was grade b. The school doesn't look especially interesting so it was of historical import I assume. The printer shop I'd defo say was for its importance.
I make my home in an abandoned RBS. The safe makes a cozy bedroom.... very dark, for a great night sleep!
Sure, many listed buildings will be private residences, within prison walls or perhaps even an inaccessible lighthouse, for example, so yes, not all will be appropriate to nominate. I only aim nominate listed buildings that not private residences and that are accessible to the general public. Thus, this eliminates huge chunks of the Historic England entries.
Buildings are listed because there is something special about them, but sure, some buildings have more of a story to them than others. I hope I can emphasise why the building I have nominated are architecturally noteworthy. As others have said, a building becomes listed because it is appreciated by the community. Maybe not all of the community, as is particularly the case with some of the1960s Brutalism that happens to be listed, but enough people decided that a building is worth saving.
Trying again (and the second building is currently in voting):
Second building has been accepted on first attempt! Re-submisison of the first building still in the queue. Will update when decision made on it.
Sadly, the first building was again rejected due to reviewers claiming it is a "private residential property". At least one person also said "does not meet criteria" too. There was no third reason given for reject, meaning only those two rejection reasons were given.