What makes a sign 'generic'???
Today I received back a rejection for an appeal I made, and the reason given was:
Thanks for the appeal, Explorer! The object in question does not meet the Wayfarer criteria as it is a generic information sign. We recommend you review the Wayspot Criteria before submitting your next Wayspot contribution: https://niantic.helpshift.com/hc/en/21-wayfarer/
I am really confused as to what now constitutes a 'generic information sign'. I thought that a 'generic information sign' would be something like a mass-produced traffic sign or mass-produced park rules sign that has no individual educational value or historical/cultural significance.
The nomination was for an information board at Sea Life Sydney, detailing the history of their star attraction Dugong. I would have thought that a unique, educational display at a wildlife exhibit would not fall under the umbrella of 'generic'.
So if this is generic, then I may have been reviewing incorrectly for a long period of time. Can I please have clarification about what generic means??
For the record, here is the nomination details:
Title: Meet ****!
Location: -33.86942,151.202141
Description: **** the Dugong is one of the star attractions at SEA LIFE Sydney. These information panels near ****’s enclosure describe his rescue and care routine.
Photo:
Comments
@NianticGiffard Tagging you as you might be able to provide a response.
(Also, the forum profanity filter on the word for 🐖 should be removed. That's silly.)
I have to say, this is the most ridiculous Niantic appeal rejection I've seen yet. Not only is this an educational nature sign, but I'd venture to guess that it's the only one of its kind (unless there is an identical sign on the other side of the exhibit or something, but even so, one of them would merit a wayspot). But out of curiosity, what were the rejection reasons for the community review?
"Generic" doesn't seem like the right term for this kind of sign. But I do wonder; any zoo, aquarium, museum, botanical garden etc. is going to have tens if not hundreds of signs like this. Would each and everyone be an eligible POI?
@Melurra-PGO The original rejection reason was Temporary or Seasonal Display. I submitted the nomination in 2019, three years ago. A few weeks ago, 🐷 the Dugong was featured in a number of national news reports about the lettuce shortage in Australia, and some of the news report footage still showed the wall of blue information signs still present around the walls of the exhibit (e.g. https://youtube.com/watch?v=rTBn7m6D8wE).
@Janetx68-PGO In this case, there are no other information signs from the aquarium that are existing Wayspots. My personal opinion though if that educational signs at the sorts of places you listed help us learn about the natural environment and the world around us, which relates to the Exploration subset of the criteria. I think that each sign should be judged on its own merits. If there are a lot of signs in close proximity, then that should not be a concern because each game applies its own proximity rules anyway. Having it in the Lightship database means another future game may be able to use that content.
Certainly, from the nominations I have reviewed, some people do seem to submit every sign in a zoo.
Mass-produced object applies to any object created through the mass production process. Printers are a mass-production process and any sign that is printed is mass-produced. Whether it is just one or a thousand doesn't change its status in that regard.
So the only signs eligible are home made. Got it.
That makes no sense.
Most information boards are created using a standard process that you would describe as mass produced, and so wouldn’t be valid. Or perhaps hand drawings on paper ( oops that is mass produced) would be acceptable but is clearly useless.
We are seeing individual designs and murals created using printing on special acrylics. This helps keep them in good order against the weather and each is unique.
This is not what generic etc is about.
I honestly think he was being sarcastic.
Yikes. What happens when we try to equate this line of thinking as such to other "mass-produced", eligible objects?"
Trail markers:
Mass-produced object applies to any object created through the mass production process. Signmaking is a mass-production process and any trail marker that is manufactured is mass-produced.
Playgrounds:
Factory production are a mass-production process and any components and playground parts that are manufactured and assembled in a procedural way is mass-produced.
Gazebos:
Gazebos are part of a mass-production process and each beam and roof that are manufactured and the tools used to assemble the gazebo is mass-produced and therefore the entire object is mass-produced. Whether it is in a park, lookout, apartment complex doesn't change its status in that regard.
Murals:
Painting murals is a mass production process and any mural that is painted is mass-produced.
And the list goes on.
*Snort* Using the same - clearly tongue in cheek - argument @TheFarix-PGO used: People are mass produced; therefore, any handmade signs are made through the mass production process known as 'birth'.
Taking that to the extreme: Every object that is not a natural feature is, therefore, mass produced. And, as natural features are ineligible to be marked as an acceptable wayspot, that means nothing can be a wayspot.
Please excuse me while I near wet myself through uncontrollable laughter!
Well if sarcastic an emoji or two wouldn’t go astray🤔
It was difficult to tell if it was sarcasm or not since @TheFarix-PGO is also very vocal about trail markers and footbridges being mass produced and generic. You've convinced me it's sarcasm, but I agree with @Elijustrying-ING that an emoji or something would gave been helpful given this particular poster's known preferences. I mean, I still wouldn't be surprised if they hopped back on and said it's not sarcasm.
I hail from an era when, if you'd asked someone what the word 'emoji' meant, they'd think it was an aboriginal word that meant 'goanna', or something. 😄
As such and even so, I have a personal tendency not to attribute to malice that which is explainable as a poor choice of words or action. I find life is easier for me, that way - less anti-depressants. 😏
Yikes. This must be your line of thinking then.
Trail markers:
Mass-produced object applies to any object created through the mass production process. Printers and signmaking are a mass-production process and any trail marker that is manufactured is mass-produced.
Playgrounds:
Factory production are a mass-production process and any components and playground parts that are manufactured and assembled in a procedural way is mass-produced.
Gazebos:
Gazebos are part of a mass-production process and each beam and roof that are manufactured and the tools used to assemble the gazebo is mass-produced and therefore the entire object is mass-produced. Whether it is in a park, lookout, apartment complex doesn't change its status in that regard.
Murals:
Painting murals is a mass production process and any mural that is painted is mass-produced.
Thanks for the clarification
Sarcasm aside, I think the sign is quite a nice candidate and I would have cheerfully approved. If this zoo was closer to me, I'd probably already be there just to see our friend with the porcine name! It's a good story and provides valuable background info including the fact that rehab-and-release had been tried but was not the best option in this case, which would make me feel somewhat better about viewing a captive animal. I hope that sign remains up for a long time to come, and that the animal continues to thrive.
I didn't know Australia had an animal that looks so much like our manatee! Dugong - I've learned a new word! Thanks for sharing!
I'm bumping this in the hopes Niantic will notice it once their workweek starts. (Questions asked on Fridays tend to get dropped.)
For the curious, here's info on the dugong and manatee's order, Sirenia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sirenia Their next closest relative is the elephant!
That is not a generic sign.
Not sure what the person doing the appeals was thinking when they made this call. Maybe their other appeal decisions should be sampled to see if there are other problematic decisions being made.
Not all Niantic reviewers know what they are doing.
I recently saw an appeal rejection of a Card shop (mostly sports cards, some gaming cards) that hosts athlete signings and opens up to be part of the city's monthly "alive after five" event - hosting customers with drinks, food, and music.
It was also rejected for being "generic." Not hardly. It's crazy that we understand their own criteria better than they do.
'Not all'... well, that's quite an understatement.
Someone else re-submtited it on my behalf after I posted this, and the sign has now been accepted. Fortunately, it seems that regular reviewers can do a better job at distinguishing between generic and non-generic objects.
Hi @Tntnnbltn-ING! I would suggest reaching out to our dedicated team (Wayfarer support chat team through the Wayfarer website) for insights on your query.
Where can a person find this support chat?
On the Wayfarer site, go to the Help page in the hamburger menu. Then click the orange bubble in the bottom right.