Good afternoon. I have a question. My submission for a community entrance sign was rejected because of not being “permanent or distinct” enough. So I was wondering why that would be since every single other entrance sign in my area has been accepted when they’re literally the exact same thing? I submitted an appeal and asked for clarity but also showed about a dozen other entrance signs and their coordinates as a question on the rejection criteria.
Is there something I’m missing about a distinct entrance sign? Does have to have some crazy sculpture or massive fountain to be accepted? Why are every other community entrance signs ok (and some are less decorative than this one) but this one is not? Thanks.
My appeal:
Apologies, I am assuming that it’s the “distinct” issue as it’s a giant stone sign and definitely permanent, so based on that I am wondering why there are two other community entrance signs on Gleedesville Road that have been accepted as wayspots/pokestops and are literally the same thing stone entrance sign with gardens - Emerald Park Estates entrance garden and sign (39.079531, -77.590239) and Dunrobin entrance sign and garden (39.078319, -77.589853)… as well as many other community entrance signs that are also pokestops/gyms in Leesburg. Woodlea Hills 1 and 2 (39.097072, -77.595518 and 39.089424, -77.600443), White Oaks Farm entrance sign and garden (39.104698, -77.574394), CCG Entrance (39.104155, -77.582224), Greenway Farms (39.094868, -77.581774), Evergreen Meadows Stone Entrance Sign (39.092949, -77.570613) and so on. They are all over the area (Leesburg, Ashburn, Sterling, Fairfax, and so on. What is it about this one that does not meet the criteria that the others do? Thanks.
This rejection message doesn’t necessarily mean what you think. The rejection reason “not permanent and distinct” comes up in three situations:
reviewers did not think the object is permanent
reviewers did not think the object is distinct
reviewers did not think the object meets any criteria (exercise, explore, social) and wanted to explicitly reject it, so reject for not “permanent and distinct” because that is the advice from Niantic
Neighbourhood signs are not really community entrance signs. They don’t assist with exercise or being social, so Exploration is the only possible criteria they meet. It is somewhat dubious to say that people explore them and enjoy finding them.
However, a lot of reviewers will accept most things regardless of eligibility.
Many actually dont really fit wayfarer criteria, but community like them so they occasionally got accepted. Wayfarer rely on community but Opinion is always divided on things like this. On the other hand its easier to get them approved if there are more artistic or historical value to it
Understood… but none of our signs (other than the town just being old) is actually “historic”… as the communities aren’t old… so it’s just confusing to me. And most likely, it’d just end up being a stop (if even that). So it just confuddles me.
Imho, Wayfarer is basically voting system. If enough reviewer said yes, it will be approved. You can decide to accept the result, appeal, or resubmit. . When resubmit ,be advise that spamming low quality nomination is subject to abuse ladder system.
When I appealed the rejection, the listing of the other stops were just to ask whether or not my submission met the criteria along with the other accepted submissions. It wasn’t for any other purpose. Besides, I don’t submit for stops often. I think this is my 5th since I started this game in 2016. Just thought it’d be a nice place to add one as I saw them everywhere else.
I know that it is confusing that existing Wayspots may not meet current criteria. But you can’t just compare what you are nominating to what you see in game. There could be something significant about the other signs that you don’t know about. They could NOT meet acceptance criteria, but having been accepted anyway, they may not meet removal criteria, which is an internal metric that Niantic uses. You should be able to state how every nomination you make meets acceptance criteria, regardless of what else you see or don’t see in game: https://niantic.helpshift.com/hc/en/21-wayfarer/section/166-wayspot-criteria/
Hello and welcome @sunny615
It is understandable that you are feeling confused.
Most of what happens when assessing in wayfarer is a case of use your best judgement.
It isn’t a tick box of predefined places. Each case needs to stand on its own merits against criteria.
This means that sometimes you see things where on balance those that reviewed it felt it was suitable. It does not mean that something similar will be acceptable.
Basing so much of your appeal on other locations may seem the right thing to do, but tgey are not relevant. In doing so you are missing the opportunity to focus your appeal on why this submission should be considered to meet criteria. You have baically said mine was rejected as not distinct but it’s just like these others
You need to make a case as to what makes your submission distinct. What makes it meet criteria. This should happen in the original submission and in the appeal.
Try not to make out it is something it isn’t but focus on what it is.
Well, I guess that’s where my question lies. Based on what was around previously, and me not really being active in this space, I am not an expert on submissions, criteria or other things wayfarer. I just play the game I enjoy, saw similar stops to this one and thought this space doesn’t have one, so I’ll submit one to see if I can get a new spot for everyone. Then getting rejected was confusing as each of the other areas I saw were also similar to this one both in imagery and description. Some were even less descriptive than mine. If it’s rejected, it’s rejected. Nothing I can do. But I wanted to be certain I wasn’t missing something that made the others acceptable. Whether it be a dancing pikachu sculpture or some other item that I failed to mention or notice. It was just to see if I could make the game more enjoyable to players (or attract new ones). Thanks for the info.
Just and update and answer to your question. The appeal was approved and will be added as a wayspot. Thank you all for your help and discussion. It’s really appreciated. Again, while I am an active player, I don’t do a lot of submissions. Only when I think it will enhance other players’ experience. Whether or not it turns into a pokestop/gym or goes to ingress (again) is not up to me. But everyone’s feedback here helped me understand the process better. Thanks again.
I am stunned that this was accepted, and believe it was a mistake by the appeals team. But I also do not think it would meet removal criteria. No wonder we are all so confused over criteria. Apparently saying “but look at all these that have been accepted” worked. Thanks for letting us know.
It is in an L17 S2 cell by itself and should become a Pokestop around this time tomorrow or shortly after if it was just accepted right now. You should see it today if the decision was older.
If you expand the map you’ll see it’s a very isolated community neighborhood. No through traffic except for residents. Unlike other community signs I’ve seen that are on major roads. In fact a lot of residents walk their dogs or jog or walk around here all the time.
The surrounding area has no bearing on whether the wayspot itself has safe pedestrian access.
Here is what I am taking into consideration in my assessment of safe pedestrian access.
The speed limit on the roads are 30 and 35mph. That is higher than residential neighborhoods in the US that have low traffic where the speed limit set at 25mph. There is a culvert between the sign and roadway. There is no direct path with the primary purpose of providing access to the object. It looks by all accounts to me that pedestrians are not intended to access the object.
In addition it is important to also consider that a person walking by or jogging is likely to be much more aware of their surrounding than someone standing next to an object staring down at their phone playing a game. Do you want to actively encourage people and drivers to be engaged with their phones along the road?
