Appeal for restoration of all the removed trail markers in my area

No, that’s just a bike lane sign. We have those here too.

I’ll explain once more in detail how this node system works for you, @NianticAaron and everyone else who still doesn’t get it.

Here is a map of all the nodes throughout the province. As the page says, you can put together your own cycle route through North Brabant with the help of the bicycle junction system. Follow the familiar signposting from junction to junction to cycle along the route you have drawn up. Try clicking on the numbered spheres. That’ll let you make your own custom route to follow. You can then print out instructions for that route or save it as a file for your navigation device. This vast degree of customizability makes it great for exploration, which, y’know, is what Niantic is supposedly all about and heavily encourages.

There is also a whole page of premade routes that will take you past all sorts of interesting sights. Let’s take this one as an example. This route takes you past multiple locations that are relevant to the life of famous Dutch painter Vincent van Gogh.

Now compare the map of this Vincent van Gogh cycling route:


To the map of the node network:

And you will see that the route follows the exact layout of the node network. All of the premade tourist routes on the official website do.

This node network is of vital importance to cycling tourism throughout the province, whether it’s through premade routes from the province’s Board of Tourism or through letting people plan out their own routes and encouraging them to explore the province that way. And the same goes for the hiking trail node network. So I really don’t understand why you’re being so uptight about this. These networks are literal peak examples of what exploration is all about.

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ok so, like a road network but for bikes. yes it’s very cool and I’m jealous but it’s just infrastructure.

"Trails that encourage following a specific official route by walking "

“Generic utility identifiers and street furniture such as street names, car traffic directional signs, and bike lane signs (et cetera) are not eligible.”

the clarification post covers this just fine.

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I see you clearly don’t understand the trailmarkers in the Netherlands, even tho it’s already explained you still purposely decide to not agree for some reason.

So then what is your opinion on the example in the criteria clarifications of the two yellow arrows that just say “public footpath” on them? There’s a thumbs-up next to them so Niantic thinks they’re fine. No trail name, no indication that they’re even part of any trail at all. Just two arrows pointing that there are public footpaths there. If that’s good enough, then so are the hiking/cycling nodes which have countless officially created routes attached to them by the province’s board of tourism.

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I would definitely liken them to the british public footpaths, as theyre a network of trails/paths/etc all across the country designed to help people exercise and explore, as well as just get around safely. Some routes are likely more interesting than others.

These public footpaths are accepted when given a good writeup of the route and what makes it cool. Not every one would be accepted, but they can certainly be acceptable. They dont all have official names but often have local names. The sign just marks that part of the route, which can then be described

I think your cycling routes sound great and I love the Van Gough trail example. I would say no matter what the thought process is around eligibility, we should be able to agree that they dont as a whole category meet any removal critiera!

That is not true, it is a network of hiking and biking trails to encourage exercise, with an official website to map out your route, but instead of it having a name it uses numbers, this is the way the Benelux and even parts of Germany work, they are tourist routes to encourage exercise, it is not infrastructure as such to just tell cyclists where to cycle.

If you check the documentation, you will see that it is also usually the tourism office of the city/region/country that is responsible for maintaining the node network because it is considered a tourist attraction again to encourage tourism and exploration by bike or on foot.

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So, @NianticAaron , I have been busy resubmitting the ones that weren’t restored on appeal (like you told me to do here: So are trail markers eligible again or not? - #23 by NianticAaron) and submitting some new ones with clear explanations and links to the official trail website (again, like you told me to do). They were all approved by the AI in like a day.

So then why are they once again being removed a few days later?

It’s really just starting to feel like Niantic has a personal vendetta against me, and I’m really starting to get tired of it, Aaron.

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Niantic doesn’t consider those sticker type markers eligible

I wonder if these are stickers:

unnamed
unnamed

Their AI sure does.

I think the sticker thing really again doesn’t take into account the local and particular use case, I can understand that a sticker that somebody sticks on a pole is considered temporary, however a heavy-duty sticker that is meant to last years as indication of a trail should be eligible, the whole reason why the stickers are not eligible is that they disappear quickly right? In this example it is not the case, it’s a case of Niantic and the community taking everything literally. We have the same problem getting the GR routes approved, official, lauded walking trails with a website that use stickers though, but I feel that is unfair and not living by the spirit of the law.

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I understand your frustration, but clearly Niantic has made a decision.
In my thread here I had a similar issue with one trail marker
Generic Business Rejection from Niantic Voting For Trail Markers

Now they did go back and approve one, but the other they did not. I even appealed it and it is just generic to them so they refused it. Apparently it has to have a name, or maybe a decision point, or distance, etc. Technically all my markers in this area except for one which is on a named trail would be needing to be removed then. :woman_shrugging:
Perhaps if more questions pop up this will be more clearly defined.
Don’t waste your nominations on ones like this. I know not to nominate anymore when I am out there unless I have lots available, which I usually don’t.

There should be no differentiation between high quality long lasting stickers and other kinds of sign. When submitting a trail marker we are actually submitting a piece of trail, and the trail doesn’t change regardless of the signsge material

I had a “sticker” accepted on appeal ie by a Niantic employee. The route is permanent and these “stickers” last a very long time - many years. I see no reason these should not be eligible, nor other stickers, as long as the trail is permanent.

I think the sticker thing is just a misunderstanding that sadly targets areas with lower public funding available, or where the councils /organisations are trying to be more environmentally friendly by using a lower impact sign vs a metal one that needs setting in concrete or a plastic one that can turn brittle and break within a few years

I personally think we will see more of the stickers over time as councils have less money and also change behaviours. I hope that attitudes towards these change too. The trails are still great places to exercise and explore regardless of the material used to mark them

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I agree. My “generic marker” was rejected twice by Niantic despite my supporting information showing the map of the trails in the area and being part of a trail system that navigates through a residential neighborhood on a mountain.

It wasn’t even a sticker. But I see it encouraging exercise like other trails and probably similar to the stickers used in other countries.

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It must not be part of a “named trail”. Apparently that’s the key factor according to @NianticAaron , even though there’s no such requirement listed in the criteria clarifications and there are literally two examples in there where the markers are not part of named trails but are acceptable anyway.

By the way, Aaron, another one of my submitted sticker markers was approved today. This one was in Niantic Voting. So both your AI and your employees are approving these sticker markers. Maybe that means they’re not quite as ineligible as you think they are?

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And I’m sure it’s a coincidence that suddenly all of my remaining trail marker submissions came back as rejected, roughly 20 minutes after I made my prior post?

Do you know how the system functions on a local level for trails?

I think Natural England maintain and fund the National Trails and there is probably an equivalent for Scotland’s Great Trails.

Local? Function? Thats a good joke.
The only local trails I’ve submitted for have broken, rusty or unreadable signage which is all metal or hard plastic. They havent been maintained in years

The national stuff - the NCN routes, Thames Path too I guess, those are well maintained and often stickers, which hold up much better than these metal signs that keep being mentioned as the gold standard of permanence

Here’s some examples - spot the local stuff…
If ever there was an advert for stickers being permanent, this is it!




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These national trails are all Natural England.
https://www.nationaltrail.co.uk/en_GB/trails/

Scotland Great Trails by this, I think governmental department.

https://www.nature.scot/

NCN are Sustrans

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sustrans

As opposed to something like this

https://hometravelguide.com/kingston-to-hampton-court-barge-walk/

Apologies for the digression @GeneralSecura