imo “need more pokestops” is just a waste of the supporting text, and the way the nomination prompts are worded, it makes complete sense why they would explain why the wayspot is important to pogo.
@NianticAaron did make a comment once that called game references in the supporting “influencing reviewers” so you are not wrong about that. But this was in reference to a specific situation on the forum, and we never saw the statements he was addressing because the OP never showed us their supporting information. I have the old link but it does not seem to have been preserved anywhere: https://community.wayfarer.nianticlabs.com/discussion/comment/253454#Comment_253454
We have never had a statement to my knowledge that we as reviewers must reject for game references in the supporting statement. And until [and unless] they rewrite the prompts, I am not going to reject these. And I am a person who hangs on to every clarification made in the forums. So yes, I can ignore it.
5 Likes
To my understanding, a Wayspot is to be removed if the candidate violates policies. Inaccuracies can be addressed with edit contributions.
3 Likes
It doesn’t matter if IDK is an answer that will push towards rejection or acceptance. It’s a neutral answer to the question. And we are expected to answer the questions not decide if it is a rejection or acceptance.
This was a change in approach that came with the new review flow.
Previously we were saying in our responses if we judged it overall as an accept or reject on a scale.
The new flow asks us to answer questions as best we can about the submission it is not an accept / reject situation. It is wayfarer team’s decision in light of those answers as to whether this is something they want in the database.
It’s not our decision.
I am trying to look beyond this particular instance, mainly because we are not looking at the information that was there in review but at the more limited and possibly changed information on an established wayspot. That is a different situation.
There comes a point when although we believe our approach to be correct that we should listen to those voices around us. Instinctively we want to build a protective wall and stick to what we know. However all I am asking is that you look beyond that and go through a private process of self challenge and reflection.
It is not an all or nothing situation and it is best to be open to the possibility that you might shift on a few things but maybe on others you will feel more comfortable with no change. Look at each aspect individually.
1 Like
“We need more pokestops,” or “this will be the first pokestop,” or “please make this a gym,” are not phrases that “make a request,” IMO.
A request would be something like, “I’ve placed this 10 feet to the right if the object so it can appear in its own cell to be a pokestop, please don’t move the location.”
The top set of phrases, in my experience, demonstrate that these people don’t understand how Wayfarer works. They probably think their submission is going directly to Niantic instead of other players. They are responding directly to the intructions they read in PGO that told them to explain why this would be a good Pokestop.
The second thing comes from someone who absolutely knows what they are doing and is intentionally manipulating the game board to their own advantage. They are asking me to assist them in that manipulation. I will not oblige them in that.
Also, as you pointed out, most of the people in this discussion are asking you to consider loosening up the way you review. The names in here are people who have been engaged on the forum for a while. They have a good understanding of how Wayfarer works. I would give serious consideration to the fact that you vote out of step with these people.
12 Likes
You do make some very good points and this exposes the serious flaws with the entire system. Especially from the point of view of a newer participant and the messaging that they encounter.
There are so many things that could be done so much better with more clarity and that is an ongoing failing of Niantic and the Wayfarer team.
Hopefully one day things will improve but unfortunately we just have to do our best to work with what they give us, it’s a shame that they refuse to make improvements to avoid these same situations coming up regularly. Its easy for those of us that have learned to navigate these things to lose sight of how poorly designed and confusing they really can be for new people.
2 Likes
I see your side of this, I really do. As an educator and as a Wayfarer, I personally like to give people the benefit of the doubt. If Niantic didn’t want people to edit things for accuracy after acceptance, the feature would not exist. At least that’s the way I see it.
It is also worth noting that most people do not have such a rigid view of criteria when it comes to things like this. A single word inaccuracy that a reasonable person probably would not interpret as something done to deceive a reviewer, would probably not be rejected by the majority of reviewers. Wayfarer runs on an agreement system, which means you most likely would not receive an agreement for that rejection. You’re free to vote however you would like on any nomination, and others are free to do so as well.
3 Likes
I think that when Niantic made supporting text requirement, they probably expected it would be used to put things like “This is a great local spot” or “A great place to exercise” and not “This nomination is great because it will add another Pokestop!”
I understand that not all game references might be breaking rules. But voting requests are explicitly not allowed. And if someone puts “There are not enough Pokestops in the area”, I see it as a request to approve this nomination so that there is another Pokestop in that area.
Wayspots can be removed if they meet rejection criteria. Inaccuracies is what should prevent nominations from becoming wayspots in the first place.
1 Like
I know that our job as reviewers is to answer questions to the best of our abilities. It seems to me that you think that people who reviewed Counties wayspot clicked IDK for Accuracy. I am not gonna even start on that it takes about a minute or two to check accuracy in this particular case. I just want to understand how IDK affects overall score, so to speak. I understand that if I click all thumbs up, it adds points toward acceptance. If I put thumbs down, it add points toward rejection. What about IDK? Does it add points to anything or is it neutral?
1 Like
I have to ask - in your opinion, how would a request look like? Because if “Please make this a gym” is not a request, then I don’t know what is.
This is one of the reasons I made this thread - to have people discuss different systems. Several people mentioned how nomination system in PoGo says Pokestops instead of Wayspots. That’s a great point, and it’s something that Niantic should change. There are little clarifications all over the place, and Niantic should put them in one spot. It’s great that we are talking about it. I understand that we have to deal with what we have, but it doesn’t mean we can’t poke Niantic and ask them to make things better, right? But after reading all the responses I got, I feel like most people don’t want to discuss anything. They want me to shut up and not point out bad stuff and to continue approving nominations that break rules. Sorry, but I will not shut up. I want to make things better.
2 Likes
If you see a cat and say it’s a dog, and I correct you by saying it’s a cat, I am not rigid. When I see a wayspot that shows California mountains but is titled California Counties and I complain about it, I am not rigid - the information is inaccurate. Words matter, even a single word. London is not the capital of France. Pele is not a famous basketball player. Beethoven is not a famous painter. One word can make all the difference.
2 Likes
A statue of a cat doesnt become ineligible because you mistakenly call it a dog. A mural of Pele doesn’t become inaccurate because i write “famous basketball player” instead of “soccer player.” In fact, that is a great example because some people would say its inaccurate to call Pele a soccer player, to them he’s a footballer. But call him what you will, the mural of him is still eligible. Yes, we should try to be as accurate as possible. But people submit made up titles for works of art all the time. Should every single artwork be rejected unless we can source the title so thwt we know it is 100% accurate?
8 Likes
All those examples actually would make a nomination a subject for rejection because of such inaccuracies. Except for soccer player and footballer - those are different words to describe the same sport. But cats and dogs are completely different animals. Basketball and soccer (or football) are two completely different sports. Accuracy is there for a reason. If Niantic wants us to completely ignore accuracy, why would they add it to review process? What’s the point of having it and ignoring it?
Where do you draw the line for inaccuracies?
I’ve created names for murals when I couldn’t find the official name online anywhere.
Should I have just named it Mural by Whoever?
This is the only one I can find that contains anything accurate
3 Likes
The nomination itself is the request. The nominator putting that in the supporting information is redundant and should be ignored.
If you’re rejecting perfectly good nominations because someone wrote “I need more stops in my area” then I’ve got a gate that needs keeping you might be interested in.
7 Likes
As someone who can spend 20-30 minutes researching some abstract mural on a utility box, I appreciate the effort you put into your nominations and I would like to thank you for that. I only wish more submitters and reviewers would do that.
I also understand that you can’t always find info about a mural, even if artist’s name is painted on them, and have to improvise and come up with interesting and suitable name. But I am not talking about cases like that.
Let’s take a look at your examples. “Kingston Guard Dog by Roo” is located in Kingston (I checked), so makes sense to put Kingston in its name. The animal painted is a dog, so adding that makes sense, too. It looks like it means business, so maybe it is a guard dog. And Roo could be the artist. So your title makes sense. But if you named it “Kingston Giraffe by Roo”, I’d probably scratch my head and say, “Sorry, but it’s not a giraffe, it’s a dog”. “I love you deer” is painted on Tandems Café. Interesting title instead of maybe less imaginative “Tandems Café Mural”. But if you named it “Coffee Bean Mural”, I’d also scratch my head and say, “It’s not Coffee Bean café, it’s Tandems café, it says it right there!”
In Counties case, the mural painted on the utility box has names on it. Someone read those names and thought they were California counties. Unlike you, that person didn’t do their research, which would take about a minute or two of googling. Then the nomination somehow slipped thru without anyone (or without enough people) saying, “Hold on a moment, those aren’t counties, those are mountain ranges!” This is clear inaccuracy.
1 Like
I guess you can think of nominations in requests, but Niantic clearly differentiates between that and “voting requests in the title, description, supporting information, or photo” according to Rejection Criteria — Wayfarer Help Center
I don’t know if I should be mad at whoever nominated these vandalized signs or praise them for their creativity:
(Larger photo here)
Pleeease tell me where it is!!! I need a photo with me at this spot!
Do you know if you can follow the love trail or the freedom trail, or is it only one? 
2 Likes
