It is a stone memorial bench on main street. Initially it was marked as a temporary or not distinctive, even though it was permanent and a stone engraved bench right on main street. Now after the appeal they marked it as a generic business? It is a stone bench.
Hello and welcome to the forum!
While you may see other similar objects as wayspots, context matters. From the Criteria Clarification Collection - Niantic Wayfarer Community :
How does your text look for this nomination?
3 Likes
Hi and Welcome @GlibbyTib
Memorial benches can be tough to get accepted. Niantic recently shared some clarification on this topic that you can find here:
https://community.wayfarer.nianticlabs.com/t/seating-benches
1 Like
Hello and welcome,
So, others have explained that memorial benches are hard to get approved, as most do not meet criteria. Context into who these people were and their importance to the community are important to provide, especially in the description. If it was just a bench purchased by family to honor loved ones, which most memorial benches are, there’s not much there that makes it meet criteria.
Also, looking at the photo, this looks like a donation from the 2 people listed on it, so it may not be a memorial bench. They may have paid money to have the benched donated and installed, something that can also be common with many seating benches. I remember when my hometown celebrated its centennial, they did a fundraiser where anyone, person or business, could sponsor a bench. These benches were then placed all around town, and all looked the same, with the exception of the sponsor info.
As for the rejection reasons, temp and not distinct means that it was viewed as being non permanent and/or indistinct. I would’ve rejected this under Permanent and Distinct for being indistinct, even though it’s permanent. However, there are some reviewers that think in order to reject anything that is generic, like benches, is to reject under Appropriate and choose Generic business. That reason should only be used for generic businesses, such as grocery stores, convenience stores, and chain fast food, but some see using this reason as the best to reject almost anything generic.
Lastly, you may want to review the Wayspot criteria section to see what can and cannot be submitted. You may see some Wayspots that do not meet critera out there, but they may have gotten approved when criteria was different, as it does change from time to time.
2 Likes
Oddly, I feel such benches are trivially easy to get in.
I used to add to the Accuracy text field something like:
Why is this person important?
Now days I just use not distinct.
1 Like
Just a heads up, whoever nominated what you’re reviewing doesn’t get to see what you type in that box.
1 Like
Which is why I used to do that.
1 Like
I don’t write in that box to inform the submitter. I write in that box to explain myself to Niantic.
(For memorial benches that aren’t significant, I also use “Distinct”)
2 Likes
Seconding this!
I see so so many sponsored “memorial” benches in pokemon go, even some that are sponsored by businesses. The standards seem very low. (I don’t even want to think about how many more were accepted by Niantic but aren’t in PoGo because of the stricter proximity rules.)
I’ve tried reporting a couple of them, but it’s always been rejected so I’ve given up. To bastardize Brandolini’s law, it’s way harder to dispute a bad stop than it was to nominate it. I’d rather focus my efforts on trying to push through my own nominations.
This is a more general thing, but please please stop using Temporary or Not Distinct when you mean “insignificant.” That’s not what that question is for. The “Distinct” part for weeding out people nominating a random unmarked tree in a forest or every lamppost along a street. Sponsored benches are distinct because even if there’s a whole row of them, you can easily distinguish them by reading the plaques.
If you think a nomination is insignificant, you should vote that it isn’t good for socializing or for exercising or for exploration because the significance is subjective. Something might seem unimportant to you because of cultural bias, particularly in geographically large and culturally diverse countries.
Remember the rule of Average Familiarity. The original comic is about experts in a field of study but to rephrase it: Even when trying to compensate for our own cultural bias, it’s very easy to overestimate an average person’s familiarity with our culture. As a nominator, it can be hard to know what you need to explain.
For example, I didn’t think I needed to explain what a county fair was, but apparently I do because my nominations for permanent, clearly marked structures get rejected for being
Temporary or Not Distinctunless I explain the entire concept.Side note: Do rural wayfinders a solid and read this post on Tips for Rural Nominators.
This isn’t as big of an issue for memorial/sponsored benches because it’s more obvious that you should explain who the person it’s dedicated to was. But there are definitely cases where a figure seems famous enough that the average person would be familiar enough to know who they are.
For example, someone nominating a bench dedicated to Bessie Coleman might think she was important enough to have instant name recognition for valid reasons. Without looking her up, do you know who she was? I know a lot of people who wouldn’t.
Answer
She was extremely important early black aviator. She was the first African American woman and first Native American to hold a pilot license in the USA.
I looked her up because I couldn’t remember if she had also been involved with the civil rights movement later in life and found out she unfortunately died young, but I hadn’t known she was also Native American before. This led me to wonder: Would I recognize the name of another important Indigenous American figure? I get matched with nominations from all over the US. I could get a memorial bench a thousand miles away for a genuinely famous activist that I don’t know.
In conclusion, cut nominators some slack and please stop reporting nominations as invalid because something doesn’t seem important to you. When in doubt, I answer Accuracy as I don’t know and write something in to Niantic and then vote that it isn’t good for Socializing, Exercising, or Exploration.
1 Like
We were specifically told to use one of the first four questions to reject a nomination:
It was never confirmed that voting down the last three questions will reject a nomination. You are probably accepting these if you are voting this way.
Not “Distinct” is as close as we can get in the new review flow to “This doesn’t meet criteria” and we have not had any input from Niantic recommending any other way to indicate this. It certainly isn’t “Generic business” that a lot of reviewers seem to be using to indicate something is generic.
I agree with you that the majority of reviewers and submitters only go by what they see in game and submit and accept these city fund raising type benches that I think is what you are referring to as “sponsored”. You are correct that once they are in game, they do not meet removal criteria.
5 Likes
In my experience a lot of sponsorsed benches most of the time are just a mass manufactured plaque with whoevers name and maybe a message that paid to have it created. I wouldnt consider those distinct just because the names/messages are different(cause often enough when you find a row of these benches every plaque is the same look just different names/messages) Something similar to these are sponosred bricks on path ways. A veterans park near me will let you pay $20 to have a veteran memorialized there. I wouldnt consider each brick distinct enough to get its own nomination(nor would I for a row of benches). Now, I would potentially consider the entire pathway of bricks or line of sponsored benches as a group waypoint. But imo they arent distinct enough individually to be a wayspot(obviously benches cost more than $20 but still a valid comparison since how much you paid to create said item isnt a factor for acceptance)
As far as memorial benches go, even IF you think the individual is famous enough to get instant recognition, you still should put why that person is important/info on that person in the description and supporting info. Why wouldnt you want to explain this persons importance anyway? Its the submitters job to tell reviewers why their wayspot nomination meets criteria and is important. Unfortunately, a lot of people dont even take the extra step to write more than just “memorial bench” in the description & supporting info which communicates nothing to reviewers about the person you are saying is significant. Ive seen some really well done memorial benches where people have done research on the person and provided articles or website etc on why they are important to their local community. Often enough these are slam dunks imo cause youve done exactly what you should. Sadly, the majority of them dont get that level of care.
6 Likes
I totally agree here. Related to that, I will tell wayfinders, especially new ones, that they should expect reviewers will not spend more time reviewing their nomination than they did in making it.
I’ll follow an earlier example and use the name of another famous person who is on at least two wayspots in my general area but may not be widely known to most here. If the nomination was for “Billy Strayhorn” and the description said, “locally famous artist”, the submitter shouldn’t be too surprised if it gets rejected.
Billy Strayhorn was an American jazz composer, pianist and arranger who worked with Duke Ellington for about 30 years. A musician is an “artist”, too.
A lot of my successful nominations are on the campus of a local university. Among them are several “generic” memorial benches with plaques on them. I got them accepted because I took a few minutes to look up the names of the people named on them. I found out why they were notable - usually former distinguished faculty or staff members with significant accomplishments - and included that in my description. I used the supporting information to include links backing up what I said.
6 Likes
- Why is such an important piece of information only available in a random AMA post? That should be on a FAQ page.
- What a horrible call on Niantic’s part…. “If you don’t support a nomination but there isn’t a clear reason to reject it, make one up.”
Also, I refer to benches with plaques that aren’t dedicated to an important figure as “sponsored” because I saw someone else on here refer them that way and liked it. It felt like a much more diplomatic way to refer to “a bench with a name on it because someone connected to that person directly paid to have their name there” than to constantly restate how insignificant Aunt Sally was. It also has the added bonus of also covering benches thats dedication plaque is an ad.
1 Like
I’m struggling to get a bench accepted for exploration heritage reasons rather than memorial reasons, but can’t get past the “not distinct” rejection (Rejection > Great Western Railway Bench > Not Distinct). It’s as if the reviewers have it in their head that park users are tripping over row upon row of the these benches brought in from railway stations, whereas in fact the evidence points to this being a rarity and something to be celebrated.
it appears from your posts on multiple topics that you have had very negative experiences with wayfarer. if you would like to share some things you think were unfairly rejected, there is the Nomination Support category. hopefully we can help you change that.
1 Like
Pretty much sums up how they are around here.